[Primer] Eldrazi Stompy

[Barook]

how is a 2 mana spell slower than a 7 mana spell? if you drop it on turn 2 you are even faster

All is Dust and World Breaker being castable on T4 isn't unheard off, even T3 with an accelerant.

The card is amazing, certainly. Early on it's a 3/3 beater for 3, which is fine if nothing worth playing in Legacy, but then it proceeds to make your opponent's creatures irrelevant 3 mana at a time and makes their equipment useless while at it. And it acts as a big Mom vs. removal too, and then they have the obvious synergies with Mangara, Flickerwisp, Stoneforge and to lesser extent, Revoker (here, they certainly one-up us). Of course, D&T lives off making the games slower and longer than normal between Tax-effects and mana disruption so it's more likely to get to the place where Displacer really shines compared to us. Of course, while we don't want it, plenty of match-ups do tend to inevitably get grindy so Displacer has plenty of chance to earn its keep here too.

It also has synergy with the SB Containment Priest. Activation mana still seems iffy between Wasteland and Port, though.

[Noloam_]

I think he's referencing the amount of turns it takes to tick up Ratchet Bomb (4 additional turns to hit a moat).

As for Moat being less prevalent in paperback due to cost, I only half agree... in my experience, legacy pilots really don't care what the cost of a card is, if it helps them pilot their favorite deck more successfully.

yes i considered that. if you play it turn 2, you sometimes even faster. you dont always make your landdrops. i even board out 1 city in the miracle match

[iostream]

how is a 2 mana spell slower than a 7 mana spell? if you drop it on turn 2 you are even faster

IMO, they both have pluses and minuses, and there are matchups where one or the other is better. It seems possible to me that the optimal solution may very well be to run a 1/1 split of World Breaker and Ratchet Bomb instead of just 2 of one or the other - but I have never tested such a split!

[ironclad8690]

I 4-1 a league today and started 1-0 in another

https://www.twitch.tv/adelorenzi/v/70899036

Streamed the last 2 of the 4-1 and the first of the next league.

Overall record:

Shardless: 2-0
Storm: 2-0
Grixis Delver: 2-0
Shardless: 1-2
Miracles: 2-1

Next league:

Storm: 2-1

[ironclad8690]

Realistically All is Dust is a 5 mana spell (I assume 4 Eye for this reason and Wasteland?).

Ratchet is a necessary evil but exposing to Abrupt Decay can feel bad sometimes. I am runnng 3/2 split All is Dust/Ratchet Bomb.

[RhoxWarMonk]

The hardest part of the colorless list is the land base IMO. I find it much less intuitive to play "what's correct", compared to the G/W build.

This is the obvious starting point:
3-4 Eye of Ugin
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
3-4 Mishra's Factory

Leaves about 4-6 slots depending on how many factories you run.

Then we have the following:
1-3 City of Traitors
1-2 Urborg
1-2 Karakas
0-4 Wasteland
0-2 Tower of the Magistrate

Going to playtest the following:
4 Eye of Ugin
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mishra's Factory
3 City of Traitors
2 Urborg

And slowly work in the Wastelands to see if they're worth the slots. Tower is an interesting meta call as well, going to see if I can find a few towers to order online as I currently don't own any to playtest with.
Karakas seems much better in the colored version than here.

[Noloam_]

The hardest part of the colorless list is the land base IMO. I find it much less intuitive to play "what's correct", compared to the G/W build.

Going to playtest the following:
4 Eye of Ugin
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mishra's Factory
3 City of Traitors
2 Urborg

this is one of two manabases that i prefer:

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/416028#online

i think it is the best way to ramp to creatures. but because i like the wasteland/thorn synergy, i am now no longer running it

[(nameless one)]

What's a good substitute for Jitte? I currently only have one. Would Sword of X/Y do any justice? Not sure if Fire and Ice or Light and Shadow could do the trick.

[Noloam_]

if you have money for SOFAI you have money for jitte. so just go for jitte



im wondering how long i will be playing eldrazi. im kinda bored by the deck. I playd UR delver last local tournament and top 8ed. perhaps that is the way to go for me in the future :'(.

[ironclad8690]

I just lost to grixis control after triple thorn of amethyst and resolving quad reality smasher.

He has 5 basics out, I TKS him with a mimic out and see cantrips and terminate. I take terminate.

His next draws are Murderous Cut, Snapcaster Mage, Murderous Cut, Young Pyromancer, Young Pyromancer, Bolt, Bolt, Bolt, Bolt.

I play and drew 4 Reality Smashers, got him to 1, but I just couldn't win. He had exactly enough cards to pay the thorn tax for every single murderous cut, was disgusting.

Game 2 I chalice 1 and he just naturally draws and plays 3 young pyromancers on turns 2-5. Needless to say, I just couldn't get there.

[RhoxWarMonk]

this is one of two manabases that i prefer:

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/416028#online

i think it is the best way to ramp to creatures. but because i like the wasteland/thorn synergy, i am now no longer running it

Thanks for the post, I can certainly see the appeal of the Thorns/Wasteland synergy but do you find you can't really afford to lose the land drop that wasteland provides? I find I need more resources, not less, so I've have only so-so experiences with Wasteland.

I also don't have the standard thorns hate package in the sideboard, so maybe that's why I don't see the same benefit.

[Noloam_]

Thanks for the post, I can certainly see the appeal of the Thorns/Wasteland synergy but do you find you can't really afford to lose the land drop that wasteland provides? I find I need more resources, not less, so I've have only so-so experiences with Wasteland.

I also don't have the standard thorns hate package in the sideboard, so maybe that's why I don't see the same benefit.

yes your argument is valid. that is why i play 2 endbringers in that list. Sometimes you indeed cant afford it. wasteland can win games sometimes and is a necessity vs lands

[bonkotsu]

I am going to the GP this weekend and 100 percent committed to Team Squid, first I have a couple of questions:

1) vs Taxes, do you guys leave in your chalices? In the past I have played tezz or affinity shells and have found chalice to be subpar. If it resolves it usually gets flickered to 0, the same goes for endless one. It only hits chalice and vial. I may be a bit warped in thinking that it isn't very good, maybe if they spend more time flickering endless one they wont be able to hit chalice?

2) Elvish Spirit Guide vs Lotus Petal. Again my mind set might be warped due to our local meta, we have a very skilled taxes player as well as a very skilled imperial painter player. Reason I ask about Petal: Doesnt feed goyf, unaffected by our own thorn or thalia effect, cant be countered for whatever reason. Lotus petal does feed Displacer though, is that the only reason?

3) Torpor Orb. Has anybody tinkered with this at all? It does hit our TKS, actually makes it terrible, but it does hit important when entering triggers. Thoughts?

I am pretty sure the rest of the flex slots are more preference vs priority, examples: Brushland vs Corrupted Crossroad , Faerie Macabre vs Leyline of the Void

Any input is greatly appreciated

[ESG]

1) Chalice is generally poor vs. Aether Vial decks, but Vial is the strongest tempo card in those decks, so I would keep Chalice in on the play and board it out on the draw. You want to be the aggressor in this matchup, and the best way to do that is to leverage your Sol lands while depriving them of Vial. The other key is to keep Batterskull off the board, either by killing Stoneforge Mystic (Warping Wail, Spatial Contortion, Dismember) or by dropping in Thought-Knot the turn after to exile Batterskull from hand, or by blinking out the germ via Eldrazi Displacer.

2) Spirits Guides vs. Lotus Petal: This mainly depends on what support colors, if any, you are playing in your list. Obviously there are considerations beyond color, as you have pointed out, but the primary reason is going to be on-color acceleration. I would always play Petal if I were running more than one support color and always play Spirit Guides if they were the same as my splash color.

3) I haven't seen any experimenting with Torpor Orb in this thread, but the card seems pretty bad. What exactly is giving you trouble that this card would solve? I would think Cursed Totem would be much better, but you would have collateral damage in turning off Eldrazi Displacer and Endbringer, if you run those. I would run Cursed Totem if I expected a lot of Elves decks, but Miracles has pretty much pushed Elves out.

[ironclad8690]

Torpor Orb is a huge nonbo with Eldrazi Mimic and Thought-Knot Seer, I would never run that.

[RhoxWarMonk]

I am going to the GP this weekend and 100 percent committed to Team Squid, first I have a couple of questions:

1) vs Taxes, do you guys leave in your chalices? In the past I have played tezz or affinity shells and have found chalice to be subpar. If it resolves it usually gets flickered to 0, the same goes for endless one. It only hits chalice and vial. I may be a bit warped in thinking that it isn't very good, maybe if they spend more time flickering endless one they wont be able to hit chalice?

This is a good question but generally I leave them in, at least on the play. I'd be more inclined to cut 1 or 2 if I was on the draw, since it wouldn't stop a T1 vial anyhow and StP would be the only real valid target early game. An argument can certainly be made for cutting more but remember if you keep them in and draw one late, you're better off setting the chalice to 2. Vial is usually ticked up to 3 by then and most of their deck are 2 drops.

2) Elvish Spirit Guide vs Lotus Petal. Again my mind set might be warped due to our local meta, we have a very skilled taxes player as well as a very skilled imperial painter player. Reason I ask about Petal: Doesnt feed goyf, unaffected by our own thorn or thalia effect, cant be countered for whatever reason. Lotus petal does feed Displacer though, is that the only reason?

I run neither (Simian Spirit guide) but it depends entirely on your build. If you're running Barook's G/W list, you want Lotus Petal, despite it's obvious drawbacks as you mentioned it gives you multiple mana sources for Displacer and World Breaker. Unfortunately, in that build you don't really have a choice (general consensus is that mox diamond is bad). If you're playing the noloam colorless version, you'll want one of the spirit guides. Simian wins out on the small edge case of being able to cast it through blood moon (with a Jitte, he's pretty good in that situation) but otherwise it's not a huge deal which one you choose.

3) Torpor Orb. Has anybody tinkered with this at all? It does hit our TKS, actually makes it terrible, but it does hit important when entering triggers. Thoughts?

Haven't tried Torpor Orb but what problem are you trying to solve with it? Elves is the only one I can think of and I'd rather just run Trinisphere.

I am pretty sure the rest of the flex slots are more preference vs priority, examples: Brushland vs Corrupted Crossroad , Faerie Macabre vs Leyline of the Void

Any input is greatly appreciated

Again, only run the pain lands if you're running the G/W version, else you'll want them to be Wastelands/Urborgs/Mishra's Factories, etc. I prefer Leyline of the Void over Macabre but it's absolutely personal preference on what you like.

Good luck at the GP this weekend!!

[RhoxWarMonk]

Torpor Orb is a huge nonbo with Eldrazi Mimic and Thought-Knot Seer, I would never run that.

Completely forgot about the Mimic, definitely makes it a non starter IMO.

[BlackYoshi]

Thanks for all the work - thinking of playing this or 4C Loam in Columbus. Leaning towards NoLoam's colorless list. Can you give a brief sideboarding/matchup guide if you have the chance? I can only borrow legacy decks so I don't get much opportunity to test!

[Noloam_]

Thanks for all the work - thinking of playing this or 4C Loam in Columbus. Leaning towards NoLoam's colorless list. Can you give a brief sideboarding/matchup guide if you have the chance? I can only borrow legacy decks so I don't get much opportunity to test!

my sideboardguide is on page 36 of this topic

[ChrisDissent]

perhaps you shouldnt buy the 2th city. riehu and i agree that it is quite a crappy card. i whould play 2 wasteland extra + 1 tower (if you cant afford those: 2 tower of the magistrate and 1 waste to have a better match vs blade and shardless decks.)

Thanks Noloam for your advice. I'll buy as soon as I can the Caverns, and then the extra Wasteland, but until that I will stick to what you've said (2 TotM + 1 Wasteland).
Thanks !