All B/R update speculation.

[NetterMizuno]

fuck, what will happen to this thread? Now we only have brainstorm left to complain about!

Next B&R announcement. Brainstorm is now banned.

I can #Dream about it

[danyul]

The tears are as beautiful as I had always imagined.

[Dr_D]

I've been playing DDFT for years, this is sad :(

[Claymore]

fuck, what will happen to this thread? Now we only have brainstorm left to complain about!

Deathrite Shaman.

I think they'll stay away from Legacy for awhile now.

The double hit in Vintage is suprising, but again, seems they're giving that format a lot of attention as of late.

[Crimhead]

Here's hoping Scroll Rack Miracles can survive as a T1 or T1.5 deck.

[rubblekill]

Enjoy Modern.

I'd rather cast siege rhino in legacy, thanks dude!

[UnderwaterGuy]

Deathrite Shaman.

I think they'll stay away from Legacy for awhile now.

The double hit in Vintage is suprising, but again, seems they're giving that format a lot of attention as of late.

The Vintage Super League is doing serious damage to Vintage. Pros play against other pros and most of them frequently want to play blue decks to have the most fun. It's completely inbred with people tailoring their blue decks to beat other blue decks. Meanwhile, in the real world, Workshops and Eldrazi decks have higher win percentages than any Gush deck. But Mentor decks get two cards banned from them instead of nothing or simply banning Mentor and being done with it. That deck is still going to be strong with 1 Gush and Workshops are probably still going to perform better than Gush decks.

[hymnyou]

daaaaaaaaaayuuum

[Crimhead]

Just for the record, folks:

Miracles—a deck that is focused on combining Counterbalance and Sensei's Divining Top to control what opponents can or (mostly) cannot resolve—has been the best deck in the format for some time. We were hopeful that this would change over time, but it has not. That alone is not necessarily enough to move to ban a card from the deck, but [B]Sensei's Divining Top comes with its own host of issues that center around the timely conclusion of matches in a tournament setting.

Miracles was not OP in WotC's eyes. Logistics was the key.

I think we can all agree (emotions aside) that Legacy is at a very interesting juncture right now - for better or for worse. Exciting stuff!

[bruizar]

The Vintage Super League is doing serious damage to Vintage. Pros play against other pros and most of them frequently want to play blue decks to have the most fun. It's completely inbred with people tailoring their blue decks to beat other blue decks. Meanwhile, in the real world, Workshops and Eldrazi decks have higher win percentages than any Gush deck. But Mentor decks get two cards banned from them instead of nothing or simply banning Mentor and being done with it. That deck is still going to be strong with 1 Gush and Workshops are probably still going to perform better than Gush decks.

This is the third time gush moves to the restricted list. I doubt it will be unbanned in the years to come. Such a shame, it's one of the icons/pillars of vintage imo, with its legacy all the way up to Tropical Storm and Gro-a-tog (Psychatog) Decks...

[ScottW]

I've been playing DDFT for years, this is sad :(

Sorry man, that must be rather upsetting.

[Claymore]

Really does open up so much deck design space it seems now. All sorts of decks can be viable without Miracles lingering in deeper in the tournament, forcing deck building concessions.

Is Caverns necessary now in DnT/Maverick?

Do we need so much Abrupt Decay, or can you get by with sideboard Nature's Claim? Not as much need for Krosan Grip. I don't even know what other disenchant varieties have been released lately.

Discard oriented strategies can make a push.

Without needing Abrupt Decay, BWR decks can open up a little.

Storm etc can abandon the maindeck Abrupt Decay, unless they're wanting to answer Chalice more often.

Interested to see what control deck will take the mantel, since something will need to prey upon all the fast combo that's about to come out of the woodwork.

[Ronald Deuce]

And the crowd goes CRAZY.

[Humphrey]

so 8 years after this poll was opened and top was the main problem they finally banned it?

theyre really quick

[CutthroatCasual]

Just for the record, folks:



Miracles was not OP in WotC's eyes. Logistics was the key.

I think we can all agree (emotions aside) that Legacy is at a very interesting juncture right now - for better or for worse. Exciting stuff!

Getting rid of ETA accomplishes the same thing and doesn't kill the last bastion of pure control because then Miracles players don't have something to durdle towards.

[UnderwaterGuy]

This is the third time gush moves to the restricted list. I doubt it will be unbanned in the years to come. Such a shame, it's one of the icons/pillars of vintage imo, with its legacy all the way up to Tropical Storm and Gro-a-tog (Psychatog) Decks...

It's very frustrating for me to see it. I don't like the Gush Mentor decks either but I really don't think Gush was the culprit for that deck and the deck was incredibly popular and played but objectively it did not perform as well as Workshops. it's brutal for 2 cards to be banned from this deck that is being played most often but was not dominant in terms of wins.

[Ace/Homebrew]

so 8 years after this poll was opened and top was the main problem they finally banned it?

You beat me to it!

I was going to point out that WotC's decision was heavily influenced by the poll at the top of this thread.

[Umezete]

I'm conflicted, I don't like miracles but never saw it as a huge deal and I don't like it when a deck gets axed.

That said, for some reason slow play is absolutely rampant in Japan and miracles players are by far the worse offenders. So I utterly understand the logistics behind the ban.

[Barook]

Long overdue, but still - fucking awesome.

[Claymore]

The kill condition of choice didn't matter. They could utilize Snapcaster to end the game. Entreat, Mentor etc just let them do it faster.

Interesting that Wizards acknowledged that Miracles has been the best deck for a long time and they were hoping the format would take it down, but the format could never adjust to it.