Has decree of annihilation been discussed for the cycling against various decks from the sideboard?
What decks would you bring this in against?Originally Posted by Valleysdai
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Miracles for one, maybe eldrazi if you can get blood moon out. Apologies if it seems stupid, I'm trying to think outside the box to improve the deck
The only issue is that those are both favorable match ups so a card like decree isn't necessary.
What is the latest stock list?
He's not tutorable though so that isnt good synergyHis biggest upside is the interaction with Goblin Rabblemaster (extra tokens and extra power added to Rabble). His biggest downside is that Rabblemaster exists and is an all around better card.
Edit: On the plus side, he 'goes infinite' with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker. Maybe there's something there?
He has plenty on synergy. You just can't run it as a tutorable bullet.
If you have him and any other threat, you basically get to kill on an uninterrupted board. Any combo of this and/or Rabblemaster kills on turn 3.
If you play rabble on turn 1, and rabble on turn 2, by turn 3 you will have dealt 30 damage.
If you play Celebrant on turn 1 and Celebrant on turn 2, by turn 3 you will have dealt 20 damage.
If you play Celebrant on turn 1 and Rabble on turn 2, by turn 3 you would heave dealt 26 damage.
If you play a turn 1 Rabble and a turn 2 Celebrant, by turn 3 you would have dealt 32 damage.
If you are playing 4 Rabbles, 4 Celebrant, 19 lands (including 8 sol lands), 4 chrome mox and 4 Simian Spirit Guide, you have just under a 20% chance to have one of these combinations happen. This means that against a deck like like sneak and show, if you are on the play, they now need to kill you on their turn 2 (or have a force of will) 1/5th of the time. That is a huge upside on what is a bad matchup, and for the cost of running a card that already seems good in the deck.
If you were to try and fit them in the Moggcatcher build to have max access to a infinite combo finish, the deck can just barely squeeze them in.
4x Goblin Rabblemaster
1x Goblin Settler
4x Combat Celebrant
1x Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
4x Magus of the Moon
4x Moggcatcher
1x Murderous Redcap
1x Siege-Gang Commander
4x Simian Spirit Guide
1x Stingscourger
4x Blood Moon
2x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Chrome Mox
2x Trinisphere
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
11x Mountain
It's certainly an avenue that I am looking at in the future.
Top has been banned, thoughts?
Time to break out the Trinispheres!
Hellbent strategy viable again?
Well I can free up some sideboard slots now that I mainly had for the miracles matchup. Cards I'm considering cutting now are boil, a couple sulfide elemental and a revoker. Any other suggestions I'm open to.
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What are you thinking of replacing them with?
So this either got substantially better or stays the same.
If Elves,Lands,Leo decks,ANT,TES and even Burn are the biggest benefactors then we got nothing but positives out of this outside of Burn, the flip side is if SNT becomes a very popular deck, not the worst but not the best thing either.
Our big hope is Elves is a top 3 deck, this is for 2 MAJOR reasons. A) Its a great MU and B) It pushes DnT which a bad MU down a bit.
I think my deck won't change much but as mentioned above I feel Revoker and Sulfurs are not as strong as they were before this but cards like Thunderbreak/Rabblemaster became a LOT stronger as Verdict is now the main sweeper and the moon effects make that VERY hard to cast:
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Sin Prodder
4 Simian Spirit Guide
3 Thunderbreak Regent
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
3 Fiery Confluence
4 Blood Moon
3 Trinisphere
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Chrome Mox
11 Mountain
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Sudden Shock
2 Pyroblast
2 Sulfur Elemental
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Phyrexian Revoker
Main Deck Cards I think I can change now or don't seem as good: 1 Rolling Earthquake (While the Sweeper effect is nice I really liked it vs Miracles as a mana sink), if your running the 4th Chandra I feel 3 is correct now.
SB: 1-2 Revoker, 1-2 Sulfur Elemental.
Cards that seem a lot better are Ensnaring Bridge, Mindbreak Trap, Thorn of Amethyst, Jitte, Sudden Shock, moon effects, Fierys and Thunderbreak/Rabblemaster.
I can see going with 2 Magma Jets in the main and shaving the 11th mountain but Sudden is so much better vs DRS which will be running rampant so I might just put 1 of those in the main over the Rolling EQ.
I think I won't change to much and take the wait and see approach, got a event in 2 weeks and I will be running 70/75 and will finally be making changes after a few months of me liking the 75.
I think with Miracles being dead there's even less reason to play Thunderbreak Regent. In my experience, it's biggest draw was as an answer to Jace as well as impossible to remove safely. I'm going to try swapping them for Harsh Mentor in the interim knowing that Miracles was one of the best match ups for it, but I expect Elves to be one of the three decks that will be big (alongside DnT and Lands). If fast combo inundates the meta (other than Elves), I will probably bring Trinisphere back into the main deck (no more than 2 copies). Depending on the meta shift, Thunderbreak may come back in but I always found myself not overly thrilled with him since we have become a Bridge deck frequently.
Sulfur Elemental could be cut completely now if you are expecting little DnT. It's an extra boost against them but Fiery Confluence is monstrously strong.
I do have a concern for Stoneblade/Maverick re-entering the format since they are traditionally match ups that gave us trouble. However, given that we have so many new tools, this may not be a big deal (praise Fiery Confluence, destroyer of boards).
In addition, based on the fact that this deck has not only radically changed from the 2011-2012 era where it died, do we need a new primer? Necro hasn't been on in a very long time and the current primer is extremely outdated. As this deck has been my primary focus since GP Chiba, I would enjoy writing up a new skeleton.
I've actually been working on a new Primer for a little while now, but was waiting for the new set because of the high rate of possible red cards entering the deck. It certainly needs one.
Let's coordinate. I can PM you and we can push something out in May to prep for Vegas.
This is all good math, but are you saying that going forward aggro with the inclusion of celebrant is the way to go? I like the list but would argue to add more disruptive cards like trinisphere and confluence, but that's more from a gut feeling because i don't have any data to back if up. Gonna play the goblinbuild Sunday and see what the new format looks like
I don't know if it's right to play this version, but its certainly an option to take. I will say you need less disruptive elements with the goblin builds, as moggcatcher is disruptive in addition to being a threat (bounces, shatters, stone rains, fogs and shocks). But yes, with the way things are going, it's possible you need more disruptive elements.
I'm certainly trying the Celebrants once they are legal to see if the additional aggression can make up some for some issues against A+B combo decks.
I've actually been working on a new Primer for a little while now, but was waiting for the new set because of the high rate of possible red cards entering the deck. It certainly needs one.http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/t...-dragon-stompy
updating it but it is a lot of work to do alone and if english is just your second language...
I just finished reading it, it's good, I am happy to help if you need any.
I noticed that you don't have a bridge stompy version, this version would have several different match ups from what I can tell. Are you keeping miracles there to show how the match up was?
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