I don't know, but what happened to Charbelcher combo? Any card banned or is just not competitive anymore due to stronger decks in the format? It was so funny...
@Thread:
Against Reanimator Leyline of the Void and Faerie Macabre are better, since Chain of Vapor is easily counterable.
Against Maverick we can use Firestorm (still polemic), but Chain isn't stopping the damage as it should, so I'm still trying to rush DR into Iona when Ooze isn't active.
I'm still confused about the strategy against Sneak and Show... any help?
Charbelcher just never was good, and continues to be bad.Also, why are you mentioning the deck?OoOriginally Posted by Calado
Against Sneak Show, what is your problem?Therapy for Sneak or Show(you are running 4 Therapies, are you not?)and laugh at the turn 2 Emrakul as you can just race that.:)
If you are in a meta that has like 90% Sneak Show you could still run Pithing Needles and Sharuum as DR target I guess:P
This man is a truthspeaker! You deserve a beer - if you see me in Ghent, you may present yourself to me as The Speaker of Truths and I will buy you a beer of choice
...or be as lucky as I am and always have the Angel of Despair when they S&T their Emrakul. =P
Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells
:16:- (See, now Erratic Explosion's a deck)
Legendary Creature - Horror
Haste, Hexproof, Double Strike, Trample
Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells is indestructible.
Permanents you control can't be sacrificed or copied.
Whenever Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells attacks, defending player gets liver cancer (This effect doesn't end at end of turn.)
13/13
Yeah, that's also what I was thinking when I saw the general lists. It probably would affect the rest of the meta somewhat, but it won't really matter much to Dredge (well, anything that doesn't take out our graveyard really doesn't matter too much anyway).
Cheers,
jares
I miss playing 16 bit nintendo games. Those were fun too.
Free counters, that's my problem. I play LEDless and I'm used to DDD to not having my discard outlet countered, so I can't outrace a turn 2/3 Emrakul.
Ofc when he counters the Study I can Therapy right after, but I'm not getting lucky against my friend.
Maybe my problem is only that I'm a newbie. Ty for the tips.
imo, you cannot DDD against decks with a solid clock, even if they've got (free) protection. Their fundamental turn is like 3 - 4 (depending on the build), as is yours if you rely on DDD.
With Careful Study and Faithless Looting, is playing 4 Breakthrough still the right number (at least in the maindeck)?
Depends on what your md looks like, but more often then not it is. Breakthrough in your sb is an utter waste of space imo
This man is a truthspeaker! You deserve a beer - if you see me in Ghent, you may present yourself to me as The Speaker of Truths and I will buy you a beer of choice
What people fail to realise when analysing the DDD plan is that you won't DDD forever. Once you have your stuff on graveyard, you start trying to cast spells. If one of them go through the opposing protection, all the best. If not, you are still in the game.
This is obviously not the right call against combo, and obviously a weak choice against decks with no counterspells, but against tempo-like decks, it's really worth it.
On the other hand, against Show and Tell, we can't afford to wait many turns, such a consistent combo with counter protection, it's part of our nightmare matches whenever they can stall us long enough. To fight this kind of strategy, we need to be extremely redundant, cutting every single piece of crap from the deck that isn't a Discard, Draw, Manasource or Dredger. At least this is my point of view.
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
Speaking about the sneak show matchup, I just noticed that was the finals at the SCG Orlando, both decks running Griselbrand:
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/..._david_mc.html
It looks like I'll end buying a set of LEDs... Discarding and dredging turn 1 is so good (even in manaless I have the wraith to accelerate).
True. The difference being that Griselbrand is actually a pretty hot tech for one of those decks, but entirely useless in the other deck...
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/...n_vs_mark.html
Griselbrand is a badass in Dredge. I gave him that tech on Saturday and it obviously did him some good.
I disagree. Irrelevant ability.
This man is a truthspeaker! You deserve a beer - if you see me in Ghent, you may present yourself to me as The Speaker of Truths and I will buy you a beer of choice
Irrelevant is a strong word. Since the other DR target were FKZ, Griselbrand helped him to reach his combo. Worked like Ad Nauseam on TES.
Poor comparison.
TES doesn't pass the turn with lethal on the board if they don't get to cast their AdN-->ToA.
+1
Flayer or Iona have FAR more relevant mainboard abilities. Even Elesh Norn has...
Besides that bad comparsion: Sphinx of Lost Truths or even Cephalid Sage [good ol' times] were there before Griselbrand, neither of them were relevant enough to stay in Dredge's mainboard.
Griselbrand needs 2 DRs to kill the Opponent [DR & FKZ] and 2 DR targets. So it wastes 1 more slot than Flayer. Additionally, Griselbrand can't win in akward situations like Flayer can.
I do agree that Griselbrand is a monster in manaless, but that's a different story.
Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells
:16:
Legendary Creature - Horror
Haste, Hexproof, Double Strike, Trample
Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells is indestructible.
Permanents you control can't be sacrificed or copied.
Whenever Kenjawn, Mutator of Cells attacks, defending player gets liver cancer (This effect doesn't end at end of turn.)
13/13
The only thing Grisel is good for is drawing 7 cards game 2-3 when you need a chain/claim midgame. Every other time, you cannot draw 7 with dredging.Maybe 5. But still not worth it for 7 life, when Sphinx does a similar job.
This man is a truthspeaker! You deserve a beer - if you see me in Ghent, you may present yourself to me as The Speaker of Truths and I will buy you a beer of choice
Griselbrand is pretty decent, I don't think he's any worse than Iona, Shield of Emeria or Flayer of the Hatebound fwiw. You just have to ask yourself whether or not you want a Dread Return target in the first place, and it really comes down to being overkill in the MD, IMO, and useful post-board when you want to differentiate your angles of attack vs Surgical Extraction and need a secondary target for when Golgari Grave Troll is RFGed.
I actually think Flayer is the worst, just because he requires the 3rd Dread Return and multiple Dread Return activations to do anything.
Anybody can win with Dredge game 1, it's really now your 75 works out over 3 games that matters.
I wouldn't say that Griselbrand's ability is "irrelevant", but I would surely say that the card's inclusion is unnecessary (which, in my opinion, also borders on being "win-more"). Its ability does surely power-up the deck to its limits, but it's not always true that the cost and benefit of running the card is essential to winning games, at least in the current meta.
I most certainly agree.
Cheers,
jares
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