[Primer] Elves!

[Brentane]

*breathes on nails and polishes them*
Been saying Shaman of the Pack will push Elves to be even more brutal in Legacy. Friends and Legacy players in my meta say no otherwise. First SCG Legacy Event with Origins being legal, Elves takes it down at first place with a single Shaman. Just saying.. Called it. Lol.

[Echelon]

I was torn and still am. Playing with some thoughts at the moment, but won't be able to test a list in a tournament for some time. I really want to get my Manaless Dredge on this saturday, so no silly Elves! yet for me.

[Lemnear]

*breathes on nails and polishes them*
Been saying Shaman of the Pack will push Elves to be even more brutal in Legacy. Friends and Legacy players in my meta say no otherwise. First SCG Legacy Event with Origins being legal, Elves takes it down at first place with a single Shaman. Just saying.. Called it. Lol.

Eh. Who said the Shaman was relevant at all through the day and against the decks Elves struggle? You could also try to link the result to the one-of Teeg/Golgari Charm/Ooze/Sage here. What did he beat in the Semi- and Quarterfinal?

[Echelon]

Finals was BUG vs. with DRS, Strixes and Goyfs. 8 counters, 4 spotremoval, 4 Hymn, 1 sweeper main and 1 sweeper and 2 Trinisphere SB.

Sounds like a pretty good MU for Elves!. Little pressure, few sweepers. In the semi's he either faced ANT or Merfolk and in the quarter finals the only bad MU could have been Omni-Tell. The other 3 were Grixis Delver, Affinity and Jeskai Delver.

Only 1 Miracles list in T16, finished 9th.

[Julian23]

/deleted; misread your post

[IMarques]

Eh. Who said the Shaman was relevant at all through the day and against the decks Elves struggle? You could also try to link the result to the one-of Teeg/Golgari Charm/Ooze/Sage here. What did he beat in the Semi- and Quarterfinal?

I find it scary that half the time I want to respond to something on this thread you do it first and in pretty much exactly the way I was going to.

[Ace/Homebrew]

I find it scary that half the time I want to respond to something on this thread you do it first and in pretty much exactly the way I was going to.

To be fair, Lemnear does live in the future... assuming you're in 'Murica!

[Lemnear]

To be fair, Lemnear does live in the future... assuming you're in 'Murica!

lawl

[Echelon]

Elvish bromance..?

[IMarques]

To be fair, Lemnear does live in the future... assuming you're in 'Murica!

Actually, I live in Russia, where the Future^tm lives in you!

[Crimhead]

Eh. Who said the Shaman was relevant at all through the day and against the decks Elves struggle? You could also try to link the result to the one-of Teeg/Golgari Charm/Ooze/Sage here. What did he beat in the Semi- and Quarterfinal?

Time will tell if the card has a home and/or helps the deck.

I haven't played Elves in a while, but I think Shaman could help in those matches where we are unable to resolve a NO and are relegated to the midrange plan. Droping this twice (with help from Symbiot) combined with a couple attack phases might get us there quicker.

Shaman can also get around Chasm because it's lfe loss. DRS can do this too, but it requires a more elaborate set up. I have high hopes for the card, but I'll wait to see more.

[AznSeal]

I just tested the shaman. It's really really good.

[danyul]

Gimme the deets!

I haven't been playing much but I was casually jamming a list with 2x Shaman and only found it useful once - while Glimpse comboing. I was able to kill my opponent by playing a Shaman 3 times but at that point I had my whole deck in my hand anyway and could have easily killed with a hardcast Hoof too. And that was actually the only time I drew the Shaman. Sooo the verdict is still out for me.

What kinda build are you running and how did you find the Shaman useful? What kind of board states were you seeing? And VS what decks? Tell me everything!

[AznSeal]

Gimme the deets!

I haven't been playing much but I was casually jamming a list with 2x Shaman and only found it useful once - while Glimpse comboing. I was able to kill my opponent by playing a Shaman 3 times but at that point I had my whole deck in my hand anyway and could have easily killed with a hardcast Hoof too. And that was actually the only time I drew the Shaman. Sooo the verdict is still out for me.

What kinda build are you running and how did you find the Shaman useful? What kind of board states were you seeing? And VS what decks? Tell me everything!

I played a pretty standard list and decided to jam 1 shaman in the maindeck. He was useful because he adds another must-counter threat. The reasons I found it useful is it's 1 mana cheaper than NO, and can be repeatedly cast with symbiote for value.

Some situations that came up:
1) Was facing RG lands and was able to tutor for the shaman to repeatedly do damage through glacial chasm
2) Was facing delver and he had a counterspell, but was waiting to counter a NO or glimpse and didn't think GSZ for 3 was lethal
3) When chaining glimpse, it kills just as well as NO does

[Luiz_AFF]

I will try the blue splah. What do you guys think?
In the MD i will go like this:
2xBayou
4x Cradle
2x Forest
2x Dryad Arbor
1x Tropical Island
4x windswept Heat
4x wooded foothills
2x Craterhoof
2x Birchlore
4x Nettle Sentinel
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Quirion Ranger
4x Wirewood Symbiote
4x Elvish Visionary
4x Heritage Druid
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Shaman of the Pack
4x Zenith
4x Glimpse
3x NO

SB:
1x Progenitus
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Null Rod
3x Abrupt Dacay
2x Krosan Grip
2x Swan Song
3x Cabal Therapy
2x Thoughtseize

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[Glimpse of Nature]

I generally splash blue if i tend to see a lot of Sneak and Show being played. Since you are running +2 Krosan Grip you can most likely cut an Abrupt Decay to add in another SS. Also cutting the new Magic Origins Elf for the complete playset (Although its cool we got a new toy and it is in our colors perfectly it generally ends up being a win-more card in most cases, although in grindy matchups GSZ for 3 kind of surprises your opponent) Few situations like Glacial Chasm aside, the verdict imo is that it is in the Ruric/Rec Sage/Sc. Ooze flex slot as a one of (Her being the worst out of the bunch) unless you want to completely remove your NO/Hoof plan and add a playset of Her and Dwynen's Elite to maximize ShamPow's ability which i am not recommending. This card long-term could end up being a very very useful card but as of right now i just don't think it is our savior card that us forest warriors have been waiting for. But if midrange decks end up running the wild wild west of legacy this card will definitely be in my 75. Sorry for the long rant was just trying to give an opinion on posts above yours as well.

[Luiz_AFF]

Do you think the blue splash helps in matches like Miracles,Omni-Tell and Storm?
Or the classic Elves deck is better?(Just BG Elves without splash)

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[Julian23]

I don't like the blue splash vs Storm for several reasons. Swan Song gives them a creature to block little chip damage vers effectively and provides a creature for Cabal Therapy flashbacks. The upside of being something they have to remove is just the same like with Mindbreak Trap except for that the later doesn't cost mana and doesn't require a blue splash. In general, Elvish countermagic isn't very good in that matchup and overall even worse than discard, but I agree that a combination of discard and Mindbreak Traps is something I would like to have in that matchup. Just not Flusterstorms and Swan Songs: they stifle your early development by keeping them open and offer no real advantage over Mindbreaktrap except for some corner-case scenarios.

Flusterstorm is somewhat similar but at least provides a pretty good tool vs Show and Tell. I don't like bringing it in vs Miracles though, unless I'm desperate.

Swan Song sounds ok against Miracles because it hits Counterbalance, but the 2/2 is highly annoying (unless you have Pendelhaven) and actually forces you to overextend when you probably don't want to. Also, Counterbalance isn't the really big deal in that matchups anyways; Sensei's Divining Top ist and that's why I love having Krosan Grip, which also works ok'ish vs OmniTell.

[Luiz_AFF]

I understand all the points. With those things said,i chanced my SB to:
1x Progenitus
1x Scavenging Ooze
3x Abrupt
3x Krosan Grip
3x Cabal Therapy
3x Thoughtseize
1x Null Rod

In the MD i remove the Shaman of the Pack and returned the 4th NO.
Sounds better?


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[Glimpse of Nature]

I like to stay in the g/b build but i do like my Ruric Thar on occasion.
But Julian said it best (As he usually always does). Splashing blue doesn't seem to be the right call.
And yeah your list seems fine man.