[Deck] Merfolk

[dinosaurus]

I found MUD hard as well. A fast start with a vial is probably your best chance to win, and Clique and Image can help sometimes.

I've only played it a handful of times. I like Dismember for sure

[ArielBlaze]

How to beat MUD:
Hold force for ugin, tidal warrior, bounce their blockers if you have it. That is about all you can do. Forgemaster is a kill if you are running dismembers(I dont), I generally don't care about metalworker. I kind of throw it out as a likely loss while I beat all the bluedecks in the room, luckily local meta only has 1 MUD deck at a time usually.

[Curby]

Heh I faced MUD in the first two rounds of a 5-round "Battle" where you need to over 9 points to get prizes (e.g. 3-0-1), so starting at 0-2 and counting on the rest of the room didn't exactly work. :tongue: I get that sometimes that's the best you can do though, and like I said I should have brought in Dismembers so I made some mistakes too.

Just curious: why isn't Metalworker a big deal to you? They seemed to ramp up as quickly with that as with actual Loci, and one opponent said that was a more important card to them than Forgemaster.

[ArielBlaze]

If they are ramping into a large creature and I have a vial, I am more than happy to let them have it(except hellkite), I will also happily phantasmal it/bounce it/etc. Ramping isnt the main issue in the match it is making sure to keep pressure on and not lose to the walkers.

[Curby]

So, my earlier question of when Harbinger makes sense finally gets an answer in MUD. I guess my Clique/Truth (the slot and thematic sibling of Harbinger) fills a similar role though.

[FANAttIC]

Realistically, if Metalworker or Forgemaster are tapped they already did the damage, MUD also plays boots to give his threat hexproof and haste, so Harbinger is not the answer.

[dinosaurus]

Hi all,

Short tournament report, I top-8ed a local legacy event today, playing the list I posted a week ago or so.

Round 1 ANT

G1 I mull to five into no interaction and he kills me turn one.
G2 I have double cursecatcher, and he can't move for a while. He has to spend two decays on lords to stay alive, which means that relic and cage stay in play. They keep him out of threshold/piF and he can't go off in front of double cursecatcher.
G3 He mulls into a no-lander and can't draw a land for four turns, when it's way too late.

1-0

Round 2 NicFit Pod (BUG)

G1 He gets pod going and kills double TNN with ministry of pain (ouch) but I someone manage to race him. I got a bit lucky this game.
G2 He cabal therapy TNN blindy, but doesn't have much to follow up. I play some threats and force a pod for the scoop.

2-0

Round 3 Death and Taxes, splashing red

G1 I have jitte online turn 3 but still loose to triple mom (the third one preventing jitte from connecting) followed by SFM into batterskull and SOFI.
G2 I get TNN + Jitte online and that's enough
G3 I get triple TNN and he quickly dies with a pair of sudden demise in hand

3-0

R4 R5, being the top seed, I double draw in the top 8

QF: Painter

G1 I'm on the play, I keep a very fast hand of vial, mutavault, three lords but no interaction. He has grindstone + painter and kills me turn 3. I don't mulliganing trying to find FOW was a good idea.
G2 His hand is slow, I find chalice to drag on the game. He tries to race me with dorks and then hides behind ensnaring bridge. I build an army of lords and venser the bridge twice for the win.
G3 He kills me on the upkeep on my second turn with pyroblast backup for my dismember thanks to ancient tomb.

The deck performed well, it had game against all opponents. He had great hands in the quarterfinals, but I had a fun time.

I'll play the same 60 for SCG Open next weekend, with only a couple of tweak to the board. Factories were great again today, I'd encourage people to try them.

Cheers!

[dinosaurus]

Round 1 was recorded:

http://www.twitch.tv/phlogisten/v/26959967

[FANAttIC]

Round 1 was recorded:

http://www.twitch.tv/phlogisten/v/26959967
Don't do "had all theese" unless he is your best friend or asked for it :tongue:
It's nice that you've won against few really bad matchups, which confirms that we are getting close to ideal main.

[Chronatog]

Hi all,
Round 1 ANT

G1 I mull to five into no interaction and he kills me turn one.
G2 I have double cursecatcher, and he can't move for a while. He has to spend two decays on lords to stay alive, which means that relic and cage stay in play. They keep him out of threshold/piF and he can't go off in front of double cursecatcher.
G3 He mulls into a no-lander and can't draw a land for four turns, when it's way too late.
Cheers!
Is there any particular reason why you did not sacrifice Relic in G2 in response to his Infernal Tutor after he Cabal Therapied you for two FoW's? You had Cage in play so why not to purge graveyards to deprive him of thresholds and draw a card? Or you were concerned about two Abrupt Decays left in his deck and possibly hand?

[dinosaurus]

Relic already deprived him of threshold, so I didn't see any reason to crack it. Drawing a card is nice, but there is always a chance to draw a counter an expose it to discard. I won't generally not crack a relic until I'm forced to, but maybe that's just me.

[dinosaurus]

Hi all,

i'll play tomorrow in the SCG open in NJ, let me know if you're around!

I'll report afterwards

cheers!

[FANAttIC]

So, dinosaurus, are you one of those 3 Merfolk players from day2?
Miracles and Grixis Delver are the most played decks, how is it possible that Merfolk does nothing in Open?

[Kevin_M]

Was at the Open in NJ this weekend, heres my brief report. (Been lurking on this thread for a while now, figured I would contribute a little!)

Round 1 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Burn 1-0

Standard "I don't play legacy but borrowed burn from a friend" situation.

Round 2 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Burn 2-0

Much more solid player, very tight match. Chalice was an all star as always.

Round 3 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 Miracles 3-0

Fairly standard Miracles list. Chalice was fine as was Cavern. Aggressively Phantasmal Imaged my Mutavaults and just ground it out.

Round 4 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 Miracles (Joe Lossett) 3-1

Very easy game one, was able to go the distance with a True-Name. Games 2 & 3 I didn't see a Lord or TNN once and the Mutavault plan didn't work against Joe's slightly more creature heavy list. This was the only loss of the day that I felt was winnable had I drawn slightly better (or if I hadn't been playing one of the better Miracles players in the world)

Round 5 LOSS 0 - 2 - 0 Painter’s Servant 3-2

Rough matchup and the games showed that. Wasn't able to land a chalice before the 5+ pyroblast/REB started hammering my guys. The upside was that the match was over so quick I had time to go eat some food finally :)

Round 6 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Sneak and Show 4-2

Bounced back in a matchup that I have a lot of experience with, which felt nice. Gilded Drake out of the side was an all star. Stole an Emrakul off of Show and Tell and also vialed it in to snipe sneak attack targets. (On a side note, Gilded Drake has been over performing for me lately in a bunch of different matches. Taking Marit Lage tokens, Blightsteel Colossus etc. have made it a nice little toolbox option.

Round 7 LOSS 0 - 2 - 0 MUD & Round 8 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 MUD 4-4

These matches hit me right in a sideboard blind spot which was pretty frustrating. Back to back MUD matches sealed the deal and I ended the day at 4-4. Out of our small group, Elves and S&T made day 2. Didn't see a single delver or storm deck all day which was too bad.

[Curby]

Congrats on the strong start and sorry bout the double MUD thing. We can be the founding members of the consecutive-losses-to-MUD-knocked-my-fish-deck-out club.

Not to exaggerate the threat here, but does it make sense (at least in a meta-dependent way) to devote some board space to MUD and similar decks? While Ensnaring Bridge is often used against us and our lord-pumping, it would help against Wurmcoil, Emrakul, etc. I know this goes against our aggro role in this matchup though. Just wondering what in the side would help most.

[Kevin_M]

Congrats on the strong start and sorry bout the double MUD thing. We can be the founding members of the consecutive-losses-to-MUD-knocked-my-fish-deck-out club.

Not to exaggerate the threat here, but does it make sense (at least in a meta-dependent way) to devote some board space to MUD and similar decks? While Ensnaring Bridge is often used against us and our lord-pumping, it would help against Wurmcoil, Emrakul, etc. I know this goes against our aggro role in this matchup though. Just wondering what in the side would help most.

Thanks! I can't help but feel the rough ending was partially due to mistakes in my sideboard build. I had 2 echoing truth to swing for lethal after building a critical mass of fish, but left out a pithing needle/null rod option to combat metalworker/forgemaster etc. Looking forward I will be including some number of pithing needles in the side, got a little too cute with hibernations and tower of the magistrate in there instead. (Although I suppose if I had taken those out I would have gotten blown out by elves all day :) )

[Figurative]

Hey guys,
I'm currently looking to get my first serious legacy deck (besides burn) and I'm thinking maybe this could be a good choice? I'm wonder how hard this deck is to pilot with very limited legacy knowledge and how good it is in the current meta? Also how linear is merfolk, as it feels pretty linear from my testing and I'm not sure I like that. Those are the main things I'm looking for in a deck, as well as maybe future options to build from it. I'm on an about $1,500 budget. Thanks!

[Kevin_M]

Hey guys,
I'm currently looking to get my first serious legacy deck (besides burn) and I'm thinking maybe this could be a good choice? I'm wonder how hard this deck is to pilot with very limited legacy knowledge and how good it is in the current meta? Also how linear is merfolk, as it feels pretty linear from my testing and I'm not sure I like that. Those are the main things I'm looking for in a deck, as well as maybe future options to build from it. I'm on an about $1,500 budget. Thanks!

Merfolk was my first serious Legacy deck years ago. I've been through a couple of different delver variants, infect and others over the years but I keep coming back to Merfolk. If you are just getting started playing legacy I think its important to note that as crucial as it is to know your own deck, understanding the field is an equal priority. In that sense, I think Merfolk is a fine starting point. You're right, it can be a linear deck, but as you gain understanding of specific matchups it is a deck that can grow with you. As a side bonus, it can be ported to Modern relatively easily should you want to run side events or whatever. Also, merfolk fits with a $1500 budget with most being in the 1300-1600 range.

[Anarky87]

We had an impromptu Legacy event this past Saturday. I decided to take a break from Jund and run the Fish and made top 4. Pretty standard list:

4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides

4 Aether Vial
4 Force of Will
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Echoing Truth

12 Islands
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
1 Mishra's Factory

I don't remember my board, but I know it lacked Back to Basics which really ruined my chances to go the distance. I played against a rogue brew (2-1), Jund (2-0), 12 Post (1-2), and then top 4 12 Post (0-2).

[FANAttIC]

Cliques against 12 Post, instead of Harbingers, could at least nab a threat out of their threat light deck.
What did Harbingers do for you at this tournament?

[Anarky87]

It was alright. It bounced a Spitemare and a Boros Reckoner in my first round, bounced a DRS eot into Chalice @ 1 game 1, bounced a Goyf game 2, which he followed next turn by playing two Goyfs, which got Truth'd the following turn and by then he was too far behind.

12 Post was rough because of both Elephant Grass and Ensnaring Bridge to play around. Those just slowed me down too much and let him get his combo's online.

[Figurative]

Hey,
I was talking to someone who knew more about me at legacy yesterday and he suggested that merfolk isn't a great choice for a big event as it has trouble with many tier 1 matchups which you are more likely to encounter. Would you guys say this is true? I really am looking to do good at the upcoming Card Kingdom 1Ks and don't want to have a deck that will underperform at them.

[Anarky87]

It might not be as great as it was when everyone was packing on the cantrips to power their Digs, but I still feel it's pretty solid. It seems the overwhelming majority of decks doing well are Miracles (34% of the T32 decks at Somerset were Miracles), Grixis, and some Shardless. Merfolk should have a great match against Miracles and Grixis. I'd say if you expect a large concentration of those decks at your tournaments, Merfolk seems like a fine choice.

I'd just be sure to get a lot of practice in with the deck before the 1k's against the popular matchups and get really familiar with them. Of course, that should go without saying, but the deck does have a bit of intricacy about it. Someone just picking it up and expecting to herp-derp-fish-army-go! everyone might be disappointed.

[Figurative]

It might not be as great as it was when everyone was packing on the cantrips to power their Digs, but I still feel it's pretty solid. It seems the overwhelming majority of decks doing well are Miracles (34% of the T32 decks at Somerset were Miracles), Grixis, and some Shardless. Merfolk should have a great match against Miracles and Grixis. I'd say if you expect a large concentration of those decks at your tournaments, Merfolk seems like a fine choice.

I'd just be sure to get a lot of practice in with the deck before the 1k's against the popular matchups and get really familiar with them. Of course, that should go without saying, but the deck does have a bit of intricacy about it. Someone just picking it up and expecting to herp-derp-fish-army-go! everyone might be disappointed.

Yeah that makes sense. Been testing online and have been having fairly good runs with it. I like the way it plays too, and it's nice and affordable. I just worry about how good it is, and whether something else would be a better $1,500ish deck -- DnT could be strong, though I would need some legacy experience to pilot it well, and some people (including Gerry Thompson, who sometimes shows up at local events in my area) have liked the idea of a slightly suboptimal infect list, maybe with some breeding pools. What would you say is the strongest? I also currently have legacy burn, but I really don't like the way it plays.

[Curby]

You're going to have a bigger impact on your event result than your deck.

But let's say you have the finest ability in the world. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can dominate a GP, and it has. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can scrub out of a GP on the first day, and it has. (See Bonanni/Schönegger at GP Lille 2015.) Similar statements can be made about other competitive deck archetypes, especially as the size of the event decreases and variance plays a greater role in the outcome. This means that even if you hone your skills, factors outside your control (matchups, topdecks, recovering from a cold, etc.) play an important role.

But first you need skills, and that comes from practice. If you spend half your time choosing the perfect metagame-busting deck, you've lost important playtesting time that might end up being more significant than choosing a deck that shaves a couple points off matchup win percentages. You admit that some decks "need some legacy experience to pilot it well." To be honest, the same is true of every deck.

tl;dr If you as a Merfolk pilot is as strong as Merfolk is as a Legacy deck, you can get there. Even if Merfolk isn't the strongest Legacy deck, you can still get there with stronger skills and a bit of luck.

[Figurative]

You're going to have a bigger impact on your event result than your deck.

But let's say you have the finest ability in the world. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can dominate a GP, and it has. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can scrub out of a GP on the first day, and it has. (See Bonanni/Schönegger at GP Lille 2015.) Similar statements can be made about other competitive deck archetypes, especially as the size of the event decreases and variance plays a greater role in the outcome. This means that even if you hone your skills, factors outside your control (matchups, topdecks, recovering from a cold, etc.) play an important role.

But first you need skills, and that comes from practice. If you spend half your time choosing the perfect metagame-busting deck, you've lost important playtesting time that might end up being more significant than choosing a deck that shaves a couple points off matchup win percentages. You admit that some decks "need some legacy experience to pilot it well." To be honest, the same is true of every deck.

tl;dr If you as a Merfolk pilot is as strong as Merfolk is as a Legacy deck, you can get there. Even if Merfolk isn't the strongest Legacy deck, you can still get there with stronger skills and a bit of luck.

Yeah I guess you're right. Merfolk seems like a really good fit in terms of legacy decks, as one of my friends has a modern merfolk deck he'd trade off, I already have some of the cards, and it seems like a nice deck for learning the format. Lately I've been obsessively grinding on cockatrice trying to find the right deck and it's been stressing me out a ton, but I think I just need to chill out and pick a goddamn deck. However, is merfolk a good choice? I am a bit worried about competitiveness as I'm a pretty big spike and it looks solidly tier 2.5 right now.

Also, you were talking about practicing and getting skills with it. Are there any specific tips you think I should do with folk? Thanks.

[FANAttIC]

One of the most powerful, if not the most, cards in Legacy is Chalice of the Void. A deck has to pay the cost to play it.
We are easily doing that while many decks are close to a scoop on turn 2 Chalice.
That alone makes it better than tier 2.5.

I am so satisfied with how Merfolk plays that my Snapcasters and Mystics are in the mail right now (selling them), as there is no need to have multiple decks anymore.

[Chronatog]

Also, you were talking about practicing and getting skills with it. Are there any specific tips you think I should do with folk? Thanks.

I echo what kirbysdl and FANAttIC said - practice makes perfect. Specifically practice with mulligans and sideboarding is very important for Merfolk. We don't have cantrips and deck manipulation spells other than Silvergill Adept, so our open hand is what pretty much determines the course of the game. So understanding when to keep and when to mulligan is important. Understanding what to bring from sideboard and what to take from the deck is also critical as Abrupt Decay and other anti-Chalice cards are common responses. This really forces you to acquire a good understanding of different decks and how Merfolk interact with them.

And speaking about big events, depending on your pairings, Merfolk actually has good chances to do well. Miracles is still the dominant deck with about 30% of the big tournament metagame and Merfolk prays on Miracles. On the other hand, it is much harder to win over Reanimator as it is so damn fast when their hand is good and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite is a complete devastation of the board.

I'm not trying to sell you Merfolk, however this deck is relatively cheap and many cards from the deck are transferable so definitely Merfolk is a good choice for someone who wants to start playing Legacy. Taking into account that you already have Burn, at some point you will be able to assemble UR Delver-type deck (if you decided to get fetches and duals).

[Figurative]

I echo what kirbysdl and FANAttIC said - practice makes perfect. Specifically practice with mulligans and sideboarding is very important for Merfolk. We don't have cantrips and deck manipulation spells other than Silvergill Adept, so our open hand is what pretty much determines the course of the game. So understanding when to keep and when to mulligan is important. Understanding what to bring from sideboard and what to take from the deck is also critical as Abrupt Decay and other anti-Chalice cards are common responses. This really forces you to acquire a good understanding of different decks and how Merfolk interact with them.

And speaking about big events, depending on your pairings, Merfolk actually has good chances to do well. Miracles is still the dominant deck with about 30% of the big tournament metagame and Merfolk prays on Miracles. On the other hand, it is much harder to win over Reanimator as it is so damn fast when their hand is good and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite is a complete devastation of the board.

I'm not trying to sell you Merfolk, however this deck is relatively cheap and many cards from the deck are transferable so definitely Merfolk is a good choice for someone who wants to start playing Legacy. Taking into account that you already have Burn, at some point you will be able to assemble UR Delver-type deck (if you decided to get fetches and duals).

Okay tht makes sense. Could you give examples of specific sbing plans and specific hands to keep?

Also I'm gonna be selling my burn deck to pay for Merfolk, so I would be selling my UR Delver stuff. Is UR Delver a better choice then merfolk though? Would you reccomend one over the other?

Thanks.

[FANAttIC]

As a UR Delver player I can confirm that it was a great deck when Cruise was legal.
Now, Miracles is the most played deck and Counterbalance is bad news.
In head to head Merfolk would probably win because Chalice is such a blowout while the only relevant spell in UR Delver is early Delver.
UR has one great card: Price of Progress, but it is not the time for it or at least people know how to play around it.

If you want to play a Delver deck, BUG or BURG are the only viable options because Abrupt Decay is important.
In small environments UR can be good enough, but if you like big events Death&Taxes, Lands and Miracles will make your life hard.

[Anarky87]

I'll be running fish again tonight if all goes well. Made the changes of swapping Harbinger for Clique MD, and added 2 Back to Basics to the SB. If it fires, I'll report back.

[Figurative]

As a UR Delver player I can confirm that it was a great deck when Cruise was legal.
Now, Miracles is the most played deck and Counterbalance is bad news.
In head to head Merfolk would probably win because Chalice is such a blowout while the only relevant spell in UR Delver is early Delver.
UR has one great card: Price of Progress, but it is not the time for it or at least people know how to play around it.

If you want to play a Delver deck, BUG or BURG are the only viable options because Abrupt Decay is important.
In small environments UR can be good enough, but if you like big events Death&Taxes, Lands and Miracles will make your life hard.

Yeah this makes sense. That's why I chose Merfolk over UR Delver, even though I already got some delver stuff. Abrupt Decay is just an insane card, necisated by an insane deck (miracles).

[Anarky87]

We had 10 people show up, attempted 4 rounds, but, in typical fashion, the store owner announced after r3 that it was being cut to a 3 round Swiss, with cut to T4. I was 2-1, but missed the cut. However, another Merfolk split the finals with High Tide. There was nothing really worthwhile to report; lost to affinity in 3 games, then beat some random pile, and finally beat a Tron deck that converted to 12 Post before the tournament.

[dinosaurus]

Hi all!

Sorry I didn't post for a while, I had a lot of work this past weeks.

I unfortunately didn't do too well at the NJ open last month (5-4). Overall, I'm not so happy with Chalice MD at the moment; I played too many BUG and Lands deck to my liking.

I'm going to try: -3 Chalice (moved to the SB), +2 Relic, +1 Harbinger.

I was never a super fan of Harbinger, but I'll give it a try. It's fine against delver, lands, elves and Bug; let see how it goes. No big tournament for me until January though.

Cheers!

[articaine]

Looking to sell my legacy merfolk deck with extras. There were several inquires about obtaining one. I am getting out of magic permanently. :frown:

Cards are ins sleeves and in excellent condition.

ebay listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/281889474388?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

[SecondSunrise]

Hello Merfolk pilots,

there will be a small christmas tournament going on at my LGS where two 10-player-teams will face off against each other with 10 decks: 4 Standard, 3 Modern, 1 Legacy and 2 THG :laugh:

I have been assigned the Legacy position, and since the opposing team is very likely to bring a blue based deck like Miracles, I think that Merfolk might be a good trump to their plans...

In your oppinion, what are the important SB cards aganst them, how does the Matchup usually play out? I was thinking about bringing something like this:

Lands (21)
12 Island
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland
4 Mutavault

Creatures (24)
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergil Adept
3 Phantasmal Image
4 True-Name Nemesis
1 Vendilion Clique

Spells (15)
4 AEther Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Daze
4 Force of Will

SB (15)
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Flusterstorm
2 Spell Pierce
2 Echoing Truth
1 Chalice
1 Misdirection
2 ???

Would be happy about any tips for the matchup and sideboarding... thanks guys!

[FANAttIC]

If you have a good read (Miracles on the other side) then yes, Merfolk is a great choice.
Most of us think the matchup is good for us and that Daze is not a part of a stock list anymore.
But if you insist on them then your list is ok and you should win.

I am not going to ramble on this pairing, everything is already said so you can read this board if you have time.

[SecondSunrise]

If you have a good read (Miracles on the other side) then yes, Merfolk is a great choice.
Most of us think the matchup is good for us and that Daze is not a part of a stock list anymore.
But if you insist on them then your list is ok and you should win.

I am not going to ramble on this pairing, everything is already said so you can read this board if you have time.

Thanks for your answer. I will read the last couple of pages and write again if I have specific questions.

[spankyourmonkey]

Hi guys!

Thank you for your advice about D&T matchup, it helped a lot.
This time I would like to ask you about a bit wider about how you think I can handle my local meta, IMO not too good from merfolks' side. Merfolk is my first legacy deck and I am still learning how to approach certain MU.

My meta looks like this

Decks that appear often:

Death and Taxes
Goblins
Burn
Maverick/Junk (sometimes two decks of this type)
Sneak and Show
Infect
Dredge
Punishing Nic Fit

Decks that appear less frequently:

Elves
BUG
Miracles
Jund
Storm
Scapeshift-Nic Fit

As you can see, most of them are non-blue fair decks. Each event for me looks like Abrupt Decay Festival, as many decks are BGx. My current 75:

4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 True-Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides

4 Aether Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte

4 Force of Will
3 Daze
1 Echoing Truth

12 Island
4 Mutavault
3 Wasteland
2 Cavern of Souls

SB:

2 Spell Pierce
2 Submerge
2 Dismember
2 Pithing Needle (i switch them to Chalices when I know elves will appear)
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Manriki-Gusari

Can you think of any changes that I can bring to my 75? Thank you in advance :)

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year everyone!

[SecondSunrise]

Just to report back to say that the opposing team brought Shardless BUG and I managed to win 2-0 with more or less no problems during the games. I really like how the deck plays and will keep it in mind when deciding on a deck for GP Prague next year.

[FANAttIC]

I won't keep it in mind, it is already sleeved for Prague :)

@ spankyourmonkey
This is rather harsh meta and other than recommending some Cliques for taking equipment from D&T, flying over Maverick, stealing stuff from hand vs Show and taking payoff cards vs Fit, I have nothing more to add.
You might want to change Red EB to something else :)

[spankyourmonkey]

@ FANAttIC
Thank you for advice :) I am surely going to buy some Cliques soon.
Of course I have Blue (not Red...) Elemental Blast in the SB, my little mistake :p

[sigmanugary]

http://mythicspoiler.com/ogw/cards/jorienruindiver.html

New UR Legendary Merfolk...any of you guys gonna give this a shot or is this just EDH only? Thoughts

[VanHendrix]

http://mythicspoiler.com/ogw/cards/jorienruindiver.html

New UR Legendary Merfolk...any of you guys gonna give this a shot or is this just EDH only? Thoughts


I just don't see this as a good tool for us. Doesn't go well with Aether Vial, once we won't be actually casting our creatures, and 3 mana is quite much. If you wanna extra draw engines just go for Sygg, River Cuthroat. Cheaper, doesn't require any splash and trigger easily. I run one MD copy of Sygg in my list, and it fits just fine (it's a more aggro oriented build, without dazes and wastes, only FoWs and Chalices and TONS of creatures).

The only reason for a red splash on fish is for Magus of The Moon... 😁

[FANAttIC]

I have a Rptq in February here: http://spielraum.co.at/de/berichte/legacy-championchip-2015-decklisten.aspx
so I found some fresh Legacy lists :)
My German is mostly nonexistent so no idea how many people showed up.
Top8 looks ripe for a Merfolk win, except he probably had to play against Elves :D

[pjetr0]

I have a Rptq in February here: http://spielraum.co.at/de/berichte/legacy-championchip-2015-decklisten.aspx
so I found some fresh Legacy lists :)
My German is mostly nonexistent so no idea how many people showed up.
Top8 looks ripe for a Merfolk win, except he probably had to play against Elves :D

The number of players was around 30. It was the final event of Austrian legacy series and it was necessary to qualify to play.
In top 4 I was paired against shardless (friend) which was adjusted for creature meta (disfigures main instead of discard, otherwise stock build).
I was able to win the first one (probably luck), the 2nd and 3rd one was disaster.

Peter

[FANAttIC]

Tnx for info!
So this is something like my Modern League, I wish we had that for Legacy.
How is Merfolk positioned in Austrian meta?

[pjetr0]

Tnx for info!
So this is something like my Modern League, I wish we had that for Legacy.
How is Merfolk positioned in Austrian meta?

There is lot of legacy cards and players in Austria. You can see all popullar decks right now: dnt, snt, infect, shardless, esper, grixis, ur delver, burn, aggro loam, tezzeret, ant, elves, jund, gwx, bug, miracles, painter. Top players are usually playing blue what means miracles, grixis / straight ur, ant.

Peter

[the_goat]

http://media.wizards.com/2015/ogw_239nCi30ks3/en_yimcAB2Iop.png

hello...I just went through the spoilers and I am not sure I understand the new colorless mechanic 100%...
if i can use mutavault/cavern of souls/wasteland mana to cast the card above I think this card can see play in Merfolks...
It resolves forever nasty creatures we are used to bounce...basically delver/pyromancer/shaman/stoneforge/mother of runes and any other x/3 we might want to kill...

on the other hand...this is valid for any deck that can afford to produce <> mana (for example is useless in 4color delver)
do you think this card will be played with 4muta/4cavern/2wasteland in a deck of 20 lands? or 50% of the manabase is not enough?
am i interpreting right the casting cost?

[Curby]

It's certainly compelling, but even if running 9 colorless sources is enough to support 1-2 of these (and I'm not sure it's enough), it misses some other important targets like Marit Lage tokens, non-creature permanents, etc. It could merit a look though.

[FANAttIC]

We are certainly the deck that can easily cast it and I am glad it exists, just not sure if we have the room.

[the_goat]

Marit lage token I agree...we can only copy it/bounce it to survive...but I was thinking it that in some scenario this new card can replace dismember to save some lives...even if goyf 3/4, tasigur, gurmag angler, batterskull token, restoration and few other creature would survive...

I really fear turn one delver otp...bouncing it means card disadvantage...this card definitely deserve a test...

30th of Jan I will play Czech legacy cup...I will try to test it before...

@fanattic would you mind sharing your latest list? Is it the one Nikachu tested in his latest video? (1 echoing 1 jitte 2clique maindexk)

Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

[FANAttIC]

Ok, this is now getting interesting:
https://twitter.com/TopLevelPodcast/status/684832263486443520

My list is still this:
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?8158-Deck-Merfolk&p=904160&viewfull=1#post904160

[the_goat]

Ok, this is now getting interesting:
https://twitter.com/TopLevelPodcast/status/684832263486443520

My list is still this:
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?8158-Deck-Merfolk&p=904160&viewfull=1#post904160

Thx for the list...and...yes that instant seems interesting...very versatile!

[Chronatog]

I'm not sure about Spacial Contortion, but am thinking about trying out this one after the new set will be released:

http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/81/603/200/283/635871722619736275.png

Can be helpful in the mid-game against creature-heavy decks and works well with Mutavault. Though, taking into account how tightly the deck is already packed, Umezawa's Jitte feels more appropriate.

Edit:

But I will try Spacial Contortion too as it may help against Mother of Runes and Sword of Fire and Ice. With eight colorless mana lands in my deck I may have enough chances to cast Spacial Contortion.

[FANAttIC]

Think about scenarios with Masterwork. It is good in none.

[dinosaurus]

I'll try 1-2 warping wail MD. I think it has enough utility to be worth testing. On the top of head:

Delver: kills DRS, delver, pyromancer, counter hymn
Shardless BUG: kills DRS, stryx, counter hymn and visions
D&T: kills MoR, Thalia, SFM, Flickerwisp
Elves: kill elves and counters GSZ/NO
Storm: counters infernal tutor, discard and PiF
Miracles: kills clique, snapcaster, counters Terminus/council judgement
Lands: counters Loam, Gamble
Painter: kills painter
Reanimator: counters reanimate, exhume, discard

Doesn't sound like enough? Or is two mana just too much?

[the_goat]

With the help of the stattrek website suggested by a friend we calculated that with 10 <> mana sources (4caves/4mutas/2wastelands) merfolks has 79% of having 1<> turn2 otp and 83% otd

I think 2 copies are worth a test
I was planning to test +3/-3 as a reply to all creatures mentioned above (+delver flipped) but this one looks more versatile

Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

[sigmanugary]

Hey guys made Top 8 in a 25 man this past Sunday. Ended up 7th with a typical Chalice build (you can find my list a few pages back)...I will pass a few notes and some sideboard changes.

Round 1 (Loss) CounterTop 1-2
Out-2x CurseCatcher
1x Jitte
In-2x CounterSpell
1x Stiffle

Notes: Tough match, dude was solid, played tight and 'boarded well.

Round 2 (Win) 4cDelver 2-0
Out 2x CurseCatcher
In 2x Dismember

Notes: N/A

Round 3 (Win) ComboElves 2-1
Out 4x CurseCatcher
In 2x Echoing Truth
2x Dismember

Then...

Out 2x Dismember
In 2x CounterSpell...not sure why I didn't grab these after 1st game


Round 4 (Win) Burn 2-0
Out 3x CurseCatcher
In 2x HydroBlast
1x Counterspell

Notes: easiest match...FWIW I also play Legacy Burn on the side so I'm familiar with the deck.

Round 5...I draw with my opponent to secure Top 8 for us both

Round 6 (Loss) Shardless BUG...I've watched the deck on camera a bunch but have limited experience with it
0-2

Out 4x CurseCatcher
1x Aether Vial
1x FoW...why I did this, I dunno :(
In 2x Dismember
2x Relic of P
2x Counterspell

Closing notes...I felt like I was pretty light on threats throughout the event but looking at it after the fact I boarded out my CC too often, too easily. I will keep that in mind down the road. Also, I stand by my MB CounterSpells and V. Cliques, the CSs really saved me a few times. My only changes are to think a little more creatively what to board out next time so as to keep my CurseCatchers.

Wish me luck, I have an invite to a Dutch Invitational Tournement at the end of the month. I will post my results when I get them...not expecting to win as it is a multi-format event and I play primarily Legacy/EDH/Casual (Standard/Legacy start...next Modern...Then Top 8 Draft)

[the_goat]

11 players tonight in Prague...
this was the metagame:
- d&t
- enchantress (Koplinchen on the source)
- 4c delver
- 2 merfolks (me and another guy with a daze build)
- burn
- infect
- miracles mentor
- lands
- 12 post
- ant (Sloshthedark on the source)

I decided to play FANAttIC MD list (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?8158-Deck-Merfolk&p=904160&viewfull=1#post904160) with only a couple of changes
manabase: 20 lands (10 island+ 4muta/4cavern/2waste) instead of 21
spells: +2 harbinger of the tides instead of 1 jitte and 1 island

sideboard ad-hoc for my metagame (if I exclude the burn and the d&t players the remaining decks were known to me)

2 flusterstorm (ant/4c delver - good with burn - good in general I would say)
2 hybernation (enchantress/4color delver/infect)
1 ratchet bomb (enchantress/miracles mentor/infect/d&t)
2 relic of progenitus (4c delver/miracles mentor/lands/ant)
2 venser (I really wanted to test them following FANAttIC list but i did not manage to cast them in any game)
2 submerge (4c delver/infect/lands)
2 misdirection (4c delver/infect)
1 back to basics (4c delver/lands/12post)
1 arcane laboratory (miracles mentor/enchantress/ant)

r1 I got paired with burn - i do not know the guy but i suspect he plays burn due to two factors:
1 - very young (20ish)
2 - red sleeves in red box (and in my experience there is only 1 type of player using red sleeves in red box :tongue:)
game 1 i win the die roll and i keep 2 chalices hand - cast both of them, for 1 and for 2 and game is over I use fow to save a creature from searing blood and then i close the game.
game 2 i keep a multiple lord hand with jitte, he sends me close to 10 lives but starts to burn my lords, i finally equip jitte and it's the point of non-return for burn, mid game he tried eot price of progress but i managed to force it, that would have been almost letal (muta/cavern + tapped wasteland)
1-0
r2 I got paired with infect i
game 1 i keep hand with island waste few creatures, he starts with noble hierarc, then another and finally the infect land, i play my waste, he discharge his hand sending me to 8 poisons and I finally get rid of the pest land...I manage to play vial but no second land...he slowly bites me with 2/3 hyerarc...here I commited a mistake that costed me the game (and the match spoiler!)...i forgot the first vial activation...this means I don't have a blocker the third "turn" of vial...and when it should have 3 counters for my nemesis...he comboes out with become immense berserk for exactly 15 damages
game 2 - land vial / land chalice / waste your infect he scoops with the hand full of CMC1
game 3 - I don't play much here...he manages to assemble the combo out with double hyerarc into infect land into lethal attack
1-1

r3 i got paired with miracle mentor
game 1 i win the die roll - he mulligans and keeps one lander with top and some cantrip but i start with cursecatcher into chalice for 1 and after spinning the top and realizing there are no lands for the next 3 turns he scoops - game lasted something like 1 minute and half
game 2 I keep a hand with triple lord, catcher, adept and island muta...greedy but confident to see 1 blue source i the first 3 cards...island catcher muta adept - find island and play my lords...he starts with some cantrip into jace looter and is forced to play and flashback path to exile on my lords - i have enough lands to cast nemesis and finish him notwithstanding his mentor and the token he produced...last useful card for him is a ponder to find fow to counter my lethal lord (the third one) but he shuffles and does not find fow.

r4 i got paired with d&t - i hate this matchup and i look forward for the new eldrazi charm to test it...
game 1 i win the die roll - land vial on both sides i manage to sneak catcher and adept and lord vs his mother and two vials only...i cast chalice for one thinking how useless would be in this matchup and he ambushes me with vial (naive attack from my side) and 3/3 vigilance flying...protected by mother...i then attach him with mutavault...and we start to race...I sacrifice another adept attacking into his 3/3 flyer he blocks and mom but this time i cast post combat harbinger of the tides...bounce mom when both his vials were on 2 and 3...nemesis finishes the game
game 2 i counter t1 mom just in time to die to a t2 mystic fetching sword fire/ice
game 3 he mulligans to 5 i manage to play 3 nemesis keeping image in hand...he plays few creatures but he cannot race me in any way and scoops

3-1 and 300 czech crowns in store credit for me (approx.11 euros/10 dollars)
Good test for the Czech Legacy cup the last Saturday of January
I really needed to train the brain (forgetting to tick up vial against infect costed me game and match and is a mistake due to not playing last 2/3 months) and remove the dust from the deck

thanks for reading!
the_goat

[FANAttIC]

1 missed Vial activation and there goes the tournament :frown:
Sounds like a Merfolk to me.
Good luck in the Cup.

[geselino]

1 missed Vial activation and there goes the tournament :frown:
Sounds like a Merfolk to me.
Good luck in the Cup.

hi guys im from argentina !!

i play merfolk in legacy for last 2 years and some time i use oboro & minamo in the pack of lands....

whi you dont use??

[VanHendrix]

hi guys im from argentina !!

i play merfolk in legacy for last 2 years and some time i use oboro & minamo in the pack of lands....

whi you dont use??

I'll try to answer you with another question: why do you USE them at all?

It's already pretty difficult to find a good non-basic land combination with Wasteland, Mutavault and Cavern. Why add those two?

[movingtonewao]

3-1 and 300 czech crowns in store credit for me (approx.11 euros/10 dollars)
Good test for the Czech Legacy cup the last Saturday of January
I really needed to train the brain (forgetting to tick up vial against infect costed me game and match and is a mistake due to not playing last 2/3 months) and remove the dust from the deck

thanks for reading!
the_goat

Could you share where I could play some legacy in prague? wanted to stay on a bit after GP prague later this year and play more magic :)

[Mr. Crane]

hi guys im from argentina !!

i play merfolk in legacy for last 2 years and some time i use oboro & minamo in the pack of lands....

whi you dont use??

More wasteland targers? Daze?

[the_goat]

Monday 6pm legacy night @Najada (metro stop Jiriho z Podebrad)
Thursday 6pm legacy night @Cerny Rytir (metro stop Florenc)

Could you share where I could play some legacy in prague? wanted to stay on a bit after GP prague later this year and play more magic :)


Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

[geselino]

More wasteland targers? Daze?

why oboro & minamo??

1º choke
2º minamo give the chance to untap vendilion

i dont use daze now beacouse 3 slot in mi deck is for chalice !!!

i play also merfolk with 3 vial & 4 chalice

whi have legacy every saturday & 1 sunday at month the Liga Argentina of Legacy, with 25/ 65 players & metagame is funny, beacouse have miracles, grixis,ant, lands, reanimator, dredge, rug, dragon stompy, bug, elves, pox, s&t & some guys play high tide....

[the_goat]

why oboro & minamo??

1º choke
2º minamo give the chance to untap vendilion

i dont use daze now beacouse 3 slot in mi deck is for chalice !!!

i play also merfolk with 3 vial & 4 chalice

whi have legacy every saturday & 1 sunday at month the Liga Argentina of Legacy, with 25/ 65 players & metagame is funny, beacouse have miracles, grixis,ant, lands, reanimator, dredge, rug, dragon stompy, bug, elves, pox, s&t & some guys play high tide....
Choke is not really a problem with vial/cavern/mutavault/echoing truth/venser...and is played only by few decks...on the other hand you expose yourself to wasteland played by many decks...
In modern oboro/minamo/w.hub are staples...in legacy they are really (really) bad...


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[FANAttIC]

why oboro & minamo??

1º choke
2º minamo give the chance to untap vendilion

i dont use daze now beacouse 3 slot in mi deck is for chalice !!!

i play also merfolk with 3 vial & 4 chalice

whi have legacy every saturday & 1 sunday at month the Liga Argentina of Legacy, with 25/ 65 players & metagame is funny, beacouse have miracles, grixis,ant, lands, reanimator, dredge, rug, dragon stompy, bug, elves, pox, s&t & some guys play high tide....If you go Island Vial, your opponent might push his Stoneforge Mystic to third turn to play aroung Daze. Oboro Vial go is like green light.
If you play Submerge, you want Islands.

In the metagame list there is one deck that plays Choke (Elves) but there is also one that can resolve first turn Blood Moon (Dragon Stompy).
Moon can also be in Miracles and S&T while Lands would love to try to Wasteland lock you while Tabernacle is in play.

My list has 6 3-drops plus 2 Jitte and I like my land drops unhindered by Wastelands until I get some counters on the equipment.
This is why Minamo and Oboro duo is not played anywhere in Legacy.

I envy your meta and regularity of tournaments.

[Chronatog]

Guys, how do you deal with Lands/12-Post/MUD and Cascade exploiting decks like Shardless Sultai and Jund?

My local metagame has changed dramatically during the last few months; I see less Miracles and Island containing decks and more combo-lands and cascade based decks. My build of Merfolk is not good against these decks for several reasons. First, Chalices don't work well against decks with a variety of cmc spells and Abrupt Decay. Second, Lands and 12-post run Choke in SB and this hurts too. Finally, Shardless Sultai and Jund overwhelm with card advantage and also run discard and remove key counter magic or bounce spell.

I added 3x Harbinger of the Tides to MB to take care of Indestructible 20/20 flyer, Primeval Titan or Wurmcoil Enginein addition to 3x Phantasmal Image and 2x Echoing Truth that I already had in my deck, but in many cases this just postpones inevitable.

My current list is below. It works pretty well against Miracles, cmc-1 heavy decks with Islands (e.g. Delvers), less efficient but still does well against Stoneforge with equipment and Maverik, and even Elves and Reanimator are not so bad. But Lands, 12-Post, Shardless, and Junds are just overwhelming. I my new meta I really miss Miracles a lot; even with Mentor it is winable.


3 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
3 Harbinger of the Tides
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Æther Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Force of Will
2 Echoing Truth
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
13 Island

//Sideboard
SB: 1 Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Cursed Totem
SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 2 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 Manriki-Gusari
SB: 2 Daze
SB: 2 Trickbind

[CptHaddock]

Guys, how do you deal with Lands/12-Post/MUD and Cascade exploiting decks like Shardless Sultai and Jund?

My local metagame has changed dramatically during the last few months; I see less Miracles and Island containing decks and more combo-lands and cascade based decks. My build of Merfolk is not good against these decks for several reasons. First, Chalices don't work well against decks with a variety of cmc spells and Abrupt Decay. Second, Lands and 12-post run Choke in SB and this hurts too. Finally, Shardless Sultai and Jund overwhelm with card advantage and also run discard and remove key counter magic or bounce spell.

I added 3x Harbinger of the Tides to MB to take care of Indestructible 20/20 flyer, Primeval Titan or Wurmcoil Enginein addition to 3x Phantasmal Image and 2x Echoing Truth that I already had in my deck, but in many cases this just postpones inevitable.

My current list is below. It works pretty well against Miracles, cmc-1 heavy decks with Islands (e.g. Delvers), less efficient but still does well against Stoneforge with equipment and Maverik, and even Elves and Reanimator are not so bad. But Lands, 12-Post, Shardless, and Junds are just overwhelming. I my new meta I really miss Miracles a lot; even with Mentor it is winable.


3 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
3 Harbinger of the Tides
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Æther Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Force of Will
2 Echoing Truth
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
13 Island

//Sideboard
SB: 1 Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Cursed Totem
SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 2 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 Manriki-Gusari
SB: 2 Daze
SB: 2 Trickbind


For the big mana decks (lands, 12 post, MUD) the plan is to normally it's hit a few of their key pieces enough to buy some time and hopefully kill them before their big pieces come online. Just play a tempo game and try to kill them as soon as possible. I'd recommend running some amount of wastelands or back to basics if that is your meta. I don't think that Jund is very favorable (it's hard for a deck with no card advantage to beat a deck with 8 removal spells and a ton of card disadvantage). Shardless is usually favorable however they can have some draws that you just can't beat. For these decks you probably want to play some removal spells (dismember/submerge) to get rid of trouble permanents. Kira is also fantastic against Jund however she (it?) might be a little too slow.

[the_goat]

Guys, how do you deal with Lands/12-Post/MUD and Cascade exploiting decks like Shardless Sultai and Jund?


Lands/12-Post are disrupted by back to basics...wasteland...chalice for 1 still blocks gamble/crop rotation/top/brainstorm/ponder/needle so is not so bad...

MUD you need bounce spells...or Vendilion to remove key pieces...null rod might help stopping metalworker...wasteland helps too...and usually aggro style play...as they take a lot of damage from ancient tomb...be sure you keep a hand with force otd for their t1 trinisphere...

Shardless sultai/jund back to basics...chalice for zero/1 is ok...i personally play 2xmisdirection in my build...is good with decay...with counters and...with Ancestral Vision! Jund make sure you board graveyard hate for PF shaman goyf etc...and sumberge his creatures in response to a fetch...

If your meta is infested with these decks bring with you back to basics...is still good against 4c delver and few other decks...

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[the_goat]

Hello...12 players tonight in Prague for our Monday legacy night...last one before new edition kicks in...is it the beginning of an Eldrazy Stompy era? Are we going to see crazy brews? Who knows...

I played same list as last report i wrote here

Metagame:
2 enchantress
1 burg delver
1 miracles mentor
1 lands
1 12posts
1 ant
1 merfolk
1 food chain
1 jund
1 team america
1 shardless bug

Round 1 got paired with Food Chain an is piloted by Adam who is a former pro player and writer for blackborder website
I don't remember much of the first 2 games but game 3 he has a coinflip choice...he has to choose if i have a bounce spell for his griffin or not...he has shaman active and has to choose between drain me for two or gaining 2 life...he choose to gain life and not die next turn...i have hibernation to bounce shaman and chalice for one on the table and I win by a miracle...

Round 2I got paired with UR Delver...game 1 he mulligans to 5...game two is my turn to go to 5...
Game three i keep a disputable hand quite slow but with potential but he cantrips/fetches into gurman angler and quickly finishes me while I struggle to find third land...

Round 3 against Punishing Jund...I did not realized I have been paired down...
In game one I have to "waste" two Fows on his confidants as that is a draw engine (paired with his removals) we cannot beat...he quickly dispatches me with double shaman and a goyf...clearing board with Pfire and double Grove.
In game two i keep another disputable hand (island, wasteland, double nemesis and back to basics force and clique) i lose poorly without drawing third land...
My opponent concede as he was 2-0 without any possibility to win prizes (only 3-1 and 4-0 get store credit)
I thank my opponent and I go to the...
Round 4 against 12posts...hard matchup...he has many ways to reset the game by fetching posts and gaining incremental lives...in both games he ramps faster than my lords and kills me very quickly...

An ugly 1-3 (2-2 on the paper...) for me tonight...
I look forward to test 2x warping wail next tournament!

[Chronatog]

For the big mana decks (lands, 12 post, MUD) the plan is to normally it's hit a few of their key pieces enough to buy some time and hopefully kill them before their big pieces come online. Just play a tempo game and try to kill them as soon as possible. I'd recommend running some amount of wastelands or back to basics if that is your meta. I don't think that Jund is very favorable (it's hard for a deck with no card advantage to beat a deck with 8 removal spells and a ton of card disadvantage). Shardless is usually favorable however they can have some draws that you just can't beat. For these decks you probably want to play some removal spells (dismember/submerge) to get rid of trouble permanents. Kira is also fantastic against Jund however she (it?) might be a little too slow.

Hope and reliance on SB are not very helpful here.

Wastelands could help, but unfortunately there is not much space for four copies of them.
Back to Basics looks good on the surface, but slow and hits our own lands, Mutavault and Cavern of Souls. In comparison, Blood Moon is more efficient and starts working immediately it enters into play.
Dismember is painful and just helps your opponent. I plan to try Spatial Contortion, but not sure whether it will help much. Never tried Submerge, because am not sure in its efficiency in Merfolks; sending back Tarmogoyf or Primeval Titan to see them shortly again doesn't help much; only if you attack for lethal and with a lot of removal it is a low probability event.

In general, I have a feeling that Merfolks is not well positioned against my new metagame. In many situations Chalice doesn't help much and there are only a few counterspells in the deck to prevent something from happening, e.g. Toxic Deluge.

[Chronatog]

Lands/12-Post are disrupted by back to basics...wasteland...chalice for 1 still blocks gamble/crop rotation/top/brainstorm/ponder/needle so is not so bad...

MUD you need bounce spells...or Vendilion to remove key pieces...null rod might help stopping metalworker...wasteland helps too...and usually aggro style play...as they take a lot of damage from ancient tomb...be sure you keep a hand with force otd for their t1 trinisphere...

Shardless sultai/jund back to basics...chalice for zero/1 is ok...i personally play 2xmisdirection in my build...is good with decay...with counters and...with Ancestral Vision! Jund make sure you board graveyard hate for PF shaman goyf etc...and sumberge his creatures in response to a fetch...

If your meta is infested with these decks bring with you back to basics...is still good against 4c delver and few other decks...


Perhaps Misdirection is good against Ancestral Vision or Hymn to Tourach, but imo in many other situations it is a huge cards disadvantage.

[the_goat]

Hope and reliance on SB are not very helpful here.

Wastelands could help, but unfortunately there is not much space for four copies of them.
Back to Basics looks good on the surface, but slow and hits our own lands, Mutavault and Cavern of Souls. In comparison, Blood Moon is more efficient and starts working immediately it enters into play.
Dismember is painful and just helps your opponent. I plan to try Spatial Contortion, but not sure whether it will help much. Never tried Submerge, because am not sure in its efficiency in Merfolks; sending back Tarmogoyf or Primeval Titan to see them shortly again doesn't help much; only if you attack for lethal and with a lot of removal it is a low probability event.

In general, I have a feeling that Merfolks is not well positioned against my new metagame. In many situations Chalice doesn't help much and there are only a few counterspells in the deck to prevent something from happening, e.g. Toxic Deluge.

you do not send back goyf/titan...you play submerge in response to a shuffle effect...like a fetch or the titan effect...to get rid of the card forever...

[CptHaddock]

Hope and reliance on SB are not very helpful here.

In general, I have a feeling that Merfolks is not well positioned against my new metagame. In many situations Chalice doesn't help much and there are only a few counterspells in the deck to prevent something from happening, e.g. Toxic Deluge.

Huh? This is the entire purpose of having a sideboard. If you are just going to concede matchups where you still have a chance of winning with a few additional cards what is the point of even playing magic? Also just bear in mind that the chalice build of merfolk isn't the end all, be all. You might actually be better off in your current meta playing a build that doesn't play chalices main and instead plays dazes. This will open you up to a bunch of sideboard cards as well.




Wastelands could help, but unfortunately there is not much space for four copies of them.



Agreed, and I don't think that you have 4 of them. I think you can run 1-2 of them if you are running 4 caverns/4 mutavaults without significantly hurting your manabase.




Back to Basics looks good on the surface, but slow and hits our own lands, Mutavault and Cavern of Souls. In comparison, Blood Moon is more efficient and starts working immediately it enters into play.



Once again I agree and I don't think that anyone is going to argue otherwise with you that B2B is better than blood moon. The idea is essentially the same though; at least for decks that try to fairly play it. You let your opponent waste some of their resources on your other things and when they are low on resources you play it. Effectively stopping them from playing spells for the rest of the game. Obviously this hurts our game plan slightly since we are playing a fair bit of non basics now, but the idea is that it's hindering our opponent more than it is hindering us. Playing blood moon when your opponent isn't tapped out allowing them to float mana to destroy or just plain counter the blood moon doesn't do anything either.




Dismember is painful and just helps your opponent. I plan to try Spatial Contortion, but not sure whether it will help much. Never tried Submerge, because am not sure in its efficiency in Merfolks; sending back Tarmogoyf or Primeval Titan to see them shortly again doesn't help much; only if you attack for lethal and with a lot of removal it is a low probability event.



I think you are really undervaluing free/cheap removal spells in merfolk. Even something like vapor snag can provide temporary relief from a large creature that is trying to beat you down or plain just save your dude from a removal spell. I have not tested spatial contortion but it still doesn't kill cards that can become big threats for us i.e. kotr, zombie fish, goyf, forgemaster, etc. On top of that it costs 2 mana with 1 of the requirements being a strict uncolored land. Like I said if you don't like playing dismember you should play some amount of submerges. The life loss is mostly irrelevant, chances are a creature that would die to dismember would probably do the same if not more damage to you anyways. Like the_goat stated you can do things like submerge their creature in response to fetches. In some situations you can effectively "time walk" your opponent by just placing the creature on top of their library forcing them to play the same creature again. This gives you at least a turn to find a counter/swing in/whatever. Each removal spell that we play is going to come with downside, afterall we are a mono u deck with limited options.

[VanHendrix]

Hello everyone!

I'm playing Merfolks for two months now (previously played ANT) and i'm still trying to fix my list to my chaotic field...

I was running a pretty straight forward build, with more creatures and only 4x FoW and 4x Chalice of The Void as "control" elements. I did well considering the horrible matches i faced, but i realized that not running Daze and Wastelands made some matchups more difficult that they should. This is the list i am working on now:


11 islands
3 Mutavaul
3 Waste
4 Cavern

8 lord
4 cursecatcher
4 tnn
2 harbringer
3 phantasmal
4 silvergil adept

3 daze
4 fow
4 aether vial
1 jitte
2 warping wail


Chalices would go for the SB...

What do you guys think? My field is pretty strange, we have Burn, Aluren, Mud, DnT, Goblins, Miracles, Jund, Junk and many others!

[WalrusGalt]

Has anyone tested Sea Gate Wreckage?

I've found Merfolk often runs out of gas, especially against the various Sultai/BUG decks running around.

In addition, Merfolk tends to get flooded, and Sea Gate Wreckage could help on both fronts, by providing card advantage and a way to use extra mana.

I plan on testing the following list, the next time I get to play a Legacy tournament:

20 Lands
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
1 Sea-Gate Wreckage
11 Island

26 Creatures
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Phantasmal Image
1 Vendilion Clique

8 Artifacts
4 Aether Vial
4 Chalice of the Void

6 Instants/Sorceries
4 Force of Will
2 Echoing Truth

Sideboard
2 Grafdigger’s Cage
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Dismember
1 Negate
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
1 Manriki Gusari
2 Flusterstorm
2 Mindbreak Trap
2 Wasteland

[kingtk3]

Hello everyone!

I'm playing Merfolks for two months now (previously played ANT) and i'm still trying to fix my list to my chaotic field...

I was running a pretty straight forward build, with more creatures and only 4x FoW and 4x Chalice of The Void as "control" elements. I did well considering the horrible matches i faced, but i realized that not running Daze and Wastelands made some matchups more difficult that they should. This is the list i am working on now:


11 islands
3 Mutavaul
3 Waste
4 Cavern

8 lord
4 cursecatcher
4 tnn
2 harbringer
3 phantasmal
4 silvergil adept

3 daze
4 fow
4 aether vial
1 jitte
2 warping wail


Chalices would go for the SB...

What do you guys think? My field is pretty strange, we have Burn, Aluren, Mud, DnT, Goblins, Miracles, Jund, Junk and many others!

I sincerely would play another deck if I was in your shoes, because nearly all the deck you listed are bad news for merfolk...

If you still intend to play merfolk I would cut the dazes and 1 fow for more gas, because you don't want to 2-for-1-ing you nor to see counters which can easily be played around against midrange decks.

Instead I would play another Jitte, another Image and a couple of Kira: more creatures and proactive protection for them.

[FANAttIC]

http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=11391&f=LE

This guy is unstoppable and nobody knows him (from our pond)?!

[daniels]

Dominik Stuetzle always makes top8 in this tournament (second place most of times), but now he got first place :) . There are some videos on youtube here (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6-gYDFg_cWAbqbgrnQtlZQ).

His list looks like the older lists with no COTV in the 75 or Wastelands. IMO, his MD is good, we can play without COTV, but we need at least 2 Wastelands to help against some decks.


http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=11391&f=LE

This guy is unstoppable and nobody knows him (from our pond)?!

[the_goat]

http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=11391&f=LE

This guy is unstoppable and nobody knows him (from our pond)?!
I think I know 1/2 players from Germany that might know him...I will ask tomorrow as they are visiting Prague for an eternal weekend...plus I will ask other 2 friends on FB

Sent from my SM-G350 using Tapatalk

[FANAttIC]

He appeared on Salvation Legacy forums, we are just having conversation.

[the_goat]

44 players today in Prague for the Czech Legacy cup

I sleeved the 75 of the "German Merfolk-naut" yesterday evening but a quick round of scouting at the tournament made me go back to 4 chalice build

i played:
10 island
10 colourless (4c/4m/2w)

23 "usual suspects" (8 lords / 4 adept / 4 catcher / 4 nemesis / 3 images)
1 clique

4 vial
4 chalices
1 jitte

3 warping wail (http://magiccards.info/query?q=warping+wail)
4 fow

side:
2 flusterstorm
2 dismember
1 manriki-gusari
2 submerge
1 echoing truth
2 tormod's crypt
1 back to basics
1 harbinger of the tide
1 venser shaper savant
2 null rod

round 1 - lost to BUG delver 0-2
round 2 - won against shardless bug 2-0
round 3 - won against miracles 2-1
round 4 - won against BURG delver 2-0
round 5 - won against knightfall (coralhelm + kotr) 2-0
round 5 - ID with S&T

top8 lost to elves 2-1
i win quickly the first with t2 chalice
second game he wins comboing out natural order for monster
third game i mulligan to 6 a terrible hand and i kept muta/waste/vial/force/nemesis/submerge...i could draw many good cards (4chalices/10 island/3 wail) instead i draw cavern into silvergill into lord...he comboes out and kills me...i did not have guts to mulligan to 5 but was probably an easy mulligan

warping wail so far passed the test...in g1 against miracles he setup terminus on top i play second lord (in play there was lord + cursecatcher) and i swing for 6...he spin the top play terminus and i counter...the turn after i attack for 9...we can say this card dealt 15 damages :tongue:

will test it again...

[FANAttIC]

Did you always had the Island for Submerge, Flusterstorm, Truth and Back to Basics?

[the_goat]

Did you always had the Island for Submerge, Flusterstorm, Truth and Back to Basics?

If we exclude the awful keep in G3 in quartefinals of top8 where i kept submerge with muta+waste...yes...never had an issue before...
to be honest i side in b2b only on the play and only against certain decks...i did not side it in much this tournament...same thing for manriki gusari...i actually played with 14 sideboard cards as I did not side it in at all...

I am visiting my mom in Milan now...and tomorrow I will play MKM series...I am tempted to play same 75...but I will decide only tonight when I build the deck...

[FANAttIC]

Peace of advice (if you choose to accept it): decide on your list and lock it in while there is still daylight.
Changing it at Midnight will not get better results. Been there.

I am sad that there won't be video coverage of MKM.
But good luck!

[the_goat]

Usually I follow your approach...but yesterday I spent whole day visiting family and then dinner out + some pool with friends...now I am on my way to tournament venue and I still did not prepare decklist!!!

Fin(ger)s crossed!

Sent from my SM-G350 using Tapatalk

[Figurative]

Hey guys, I'm almost done building folk and for most of the deck's duration I didn't run Daze. However I decided to test it yesterday and it seemed fairly strong but situational. What are you guys' thoughts on it? I'd be taking out 2 MD Harbingers and moving the Echoing Truth to the side (most likely) for it.

[CptHaddock]

Hey guys, I'm almost done building folk and for most of the deck's duration I didn't run Daze. However I decided to test it yesterday and it seemed fairly strong but situational. What are you guys' thoughts on it? I'd be taking out 2 MD Harbingers and moving the Echoing Truth to the side (most likely) for it.

Daze is a fine card, however I would not play dazes if you are running the 4 chalice maindeck version of merfolk.

[the_goat]

hi guys,

minireport of MKM series in Milan last Saturday...unfortunately I dropped at 2-3...I think there were 108 players...

I played same list as last tournament:
10 island
10 colourless (4c/4m/2w)

23 "usual suspects" (8 lords / 4 adept / 4 catcher / 4 nemesis / 3 images)
1 clique

4 vial
4 chalices
1 jitte

3 warping wail
4 fow

side:
2 flusterstorm
2 dismember
1 manriki-gusari
2 submerge
1 echoing truth
2 tormod's crypt
1 back to basics
1 harbinger of the tide
1 venser shaper savant
2 null rod

round1 I lost to bug delver...i won a quick game1 because he went to 4cards on the play,,,he crushed me on game 2 with a nasty fow on my chalice for 1 and lots of spells...game 2 is my turn to mulligan and I never caught up is delver turn1 + flip...I was always behind...

round2 I won against Aluren...that I did not think it was Aluren as I quickly won on game 1 seeing only shardless and strixes...anyway...2 quick rounds where multiple lords killed him quickly

round 3 I won against bug delver...an unexperienced french player...that was reading every merfolk card...and was always in doubt on when to stifle abilities...after he stifled 2x my adepts he died orribly against jitte....

round 4 best matches of the day against aggro loam...i won the first game but then i lost two instense games where we exchanged all type of resources...creatures, submerges, tormod's crypt, liliana etc...three beautiful games that exausted me...

round 5 I realize is not my day when I lose quickly to burn...0-2...first game he flooded a bit with 6 mountains...but vial is slow to tick up and I do not see chalices...and...he kills me with 3x of fireblast...round 2 I keep muta vial chalice double silvergill adept force after a mulligan and when I found 2nd land for chalice he finished me off with 2x rift bolt suspended...

I decided to drop to go back home...rest and spend time to visit my family...and because day2 I knew I was going to play modern...
I am really disappointed by the deck...I basically mulliganed every single match...opening hands with zero lands was so frequent and frustrating...and the two/three games I kept with monoland vial...I never drew the second...I am probably changing the list for Prague Eternal next month...in 10 matches (last two tournaments) warping wail was relevant probably once...perhaps deserves 1/2 slots in sideboard nut I am not completely sold on it...

[the_goat]

Three quick rounds in Prague tonight...and I even got bye the first round...

R2 - Esperblade
I was paired against a young guy that apparently never played against merfolks...game 1 on the play I resolve cursecatcher...he tries to thoughtseize me...I have chalice and backup counter...so I sac Catcher and resolve Chalice...he plays a Nemesis but does not attack...not realizing I have islandwalk...i quickly win the race...game2 I have jitte in opening hand and I feel safe when he plays mystic for jitte (he told me after the match he does not own SOFI...)...i play my one followed by double lord.. and I manage to win quickly...

R3 I got paired against 4c delver...we played relaxed as we decided to split prizes (everyone with 3-0 or 2-1 gets prizes) and I quickly win 2-0 resolving cavern-vial cavern-chalice and nemesis...g2 I have flusterstorm at right moment for his RB command...

This was third tournament with land split 10/10 (colorless for warping wail) and I found it quite hard when I keep borderline hands (like cavern-vial-muta-chalice) next tournament I will go -1wasteland +1 island...

Sent from my SM-G350 using Tapatalk

[geselino]

hi guys check the metagame & also my deck in the LIGA ARGENTINA DE LEGACY

http://legacyarg.blogspot.com.ar/2016/01/metagame-legacy-series-6.html

[geselino]

tomorrow i go to play with the same deck but i change my SB

+1 thada adel acquisitor
+1 back to basics

-1 laboratory arcane
-1 hurkys recall

[FANAttIC]

hi guys check the metagame & also my deck in the LIGA ARGENTINA DE LEGACY

http://legacyarg.blogspot.com.ar/2016/01/metagame-legacy-series-6.html
Nicolas, how many people were at that tournament? How were Harbingers, did they do anything?
Thada Adel is too slow if your goal is to take their Sword of Fire&Ice or any other threatening Artifact.

[geselino]

Nicolas, how many people were at that tournament? How were Harbingers, did they do anything?
Thada Adel is too slow if your goal is to take their Sword of Fire&Ice or any other threatening Artifact.

in this tournament 35 players..

yesterday in a local tournament i play & finish 3-1

1º game with a new legacy guy .... 2-0

2º game a loss with STOMPYNG DRAGON 0-2

i take bad decisions beacouse in the 2 game i have 2 tnn & 1 lord and a attack in 2 time but dont kill hem... he play quickly sarkan, and 2 criatures 1/3 with first strike, double strike & trample equipped with jitte ... and kill me ...

3º game i win 2-1 to ANT

1º game chalice in 0 & 1
2º game he resolve ant
3º chalice again + back to basic + 2 fow

3º game vs bug shardless 2-1

1º he win with shaman, tarmo & shardless
2º i win with B to B in 3º turn, missdirection to change himn to tourach, chalice in 0 x ancestral visions, and jitte
3º chalice in 0 + tada in 3º turn i attack i exile null rod + shardless x 3...i kill with lords easly

thada adel is good for my beacouse my meta have miracles, bug shardless, 4 color delver

[FANAttIC]

Well, if you exiled Null Rod and 3 Shardless Agents that means you attacked 4 times with Thada. She could have been any other merfolk when he had no defense.

[Figurative]

Hey guys, took this deck to its first tournament today with the following list:

12 Island
3 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
1 Wasteland

4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True Name Nemesis
1 Vendillion Clique

4 Aether Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
2 Umezawa's Jitte

SB:
2 Back to Basics
2 Dismember
2 Echoing Truth
1 Flusterstorm
1 Misdirection
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Spell Pierce
2 Submerge

Round 1:
DNT Lost 2-0

I mentioned to my opponent about how this was one of my first legacy events and my first with this deck, and he said it was his first with his in a while. This made me feel a bit better as it meant my opponent wasn't a legacy expert or anything. Game one was close as I got a true name online, plus a copy of it with image, and eventually a jitte. Sadly he got a batterskull out, then a sword of fire and ice to close the deal. RIP me. Game 2 we both mulled, but I kept a crappy 5 and couldn't draw out of it.

Round 2:
Jank Won 2-0

So this guys's deck was...interesting. Basically it was an artifact themed white weenie deck running everything from signal pest to loyal pegasus, armegeddon to land tax. I crushed him in 2 games without much trouble...not too much to say here. The guy mentioned he mainly played vintage, which I got the impression was just as casual as his legacy deck, just with some randomly powerful vintage cards.

Round 3:
Burn Won 2-1

This was definitely the closest game of the night. Game 1 I had a jitte that I equipped to a cursecatcher turn 3, however it got fireblasted away. He killed me the next turn, thanks to a turn 1 swiftspear, turn 2 eidolon. Game 2 I had chalice + jitte which won me the game without too much trouble. Game 3 I had that as well, however it was way closer since he had turn 1 swiftspear into turn 2 double swiftspear. However, I shut him out of his other cmc 1 spells, which was presumably a good chunk of his hand. The big turning point came when I had an untapped lord of atlantis in play, along with a tapped master of the pearl trident (both 3/3 because of their buffs). He swung with his two prowess-triggered swiftspears and I blocked one with the lord. I pointed out that it died, and he mentioned that he thought it was only a 2/2. He likely was done for anyways, since my jitte got very out of hand, but that sealed the deal.

Round 4:
Miracles Lost 2-0
I noticed I got paired down to a 1-1-1 opponent, which lead me to believe it was miracles. I felt excited as I've heard about what a good matchup it is for merfolk. Be careful what you ask for I guess, as it was Miracles but I got wrecked. Game 1, he dropped a Jace that got out of hand very quickly. However my big mistake was trying to play too fast and not playing a lord before combat -- I had a silvergill adept and mutavault in play which would have been able to KO the jace if I had played my master of the pearl trident, however I forgot to put him in play after tapping the mana and paid the price. I got style points for phantasmal imaging his venser, bouncing his ready to ult jace, but I still lost as I flooded hard, drawing no more creatures besides a true name that got countered. Game 2 I got him down to one but I flooded pretty hard this game too and he had all the answers. He eventually got the karakas-clique lock online that removed my would-be-game-winning true names and game me more lands. Ugh.

Overall I had fun, and this definitely made me wanna play more legacy. I do feel like I may wanna run more creatures however, given how often I couldn't find any, so I should probably cut either the dazes or the chalices. In addition, I feel like a Mankiri-Gusari in the sideboard would be helpful, given how good it is when equipment gets out of hand. Thoughts?

[FANAttIC]

Some of us play 2 Vendilion Clique in the main to steal equipment in response to Mystic activation or to "counter" Terminus or Entreat or cycle useless Vial or make way to cast and equip Jitte next turn or any number of other useful things.
Daze is a relic of past.

[Figurative]

Some of us play 2 Vendilion Clique in the main to steal equipment in response to Mystic activation or to "counter" Terminus or Entreat or cycle useless Vial or make way to cast and equip Jitte next turn or any number of other useful things.
Daze is a relic of past.

Totally forgot to include it, I actually ran 1 Clique mainboard. I used to counter a Terminus from Miracles, but sadly I didn't see it against DNT.

According to MTG Top 8, it's still commonly run: http://mtgtop8.com/compare. However, I do have to say it seemed pretty dead most games, so what should I replace it with? Reejerys?

[FANAttIC]

3 Daze can become Clique, Echoing Truth and Wasteland = my maindeck :)
That way you have max support for three-drops and have better chance for quick Jitte activation, while still maintaining level of control (all are interaction cards).
Or I am biased. Even if Clique reveals terrifying cards in their hand, the information is gold (the card is almost unplayed in any format but rules in Legacy, hence the price).

Then you also get a free slot in the sideboard.

Reej is underwhelming option, always there but meh.

[Kl'rt]

When I look at the most successful Legacy decks now, it seems to me like Merfolk is positioned very well. When I last played Merfolk, Chalice was not commonly played main deck, and so my understanding of the match-ups:

Miracle - favoured: Vials and Caverns go through counter-magic and Counter-Top. They have to have Terminus or Council's Judgment to stop TNN. With Chalice, I would imagine it makes this more in favour of Merfolk.

Shardless BUG - favoured: Giant island-walkers too fast for their card advantage to matter.

ANT - even: Does main-deck Chalice now make this one favoured?

Delver - even: Isn't this one also favoured now since Chalice wrecks Delver?

Death and Taxes - even?: Not sure about this.

Elves - unfavoured: Pretty sure it was highly unfavourable back then, but doesn't Chalice just stop Elves cold? Does it make this one favoured for Merfolk now?

Aggro Loam - unfavoured: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember Merfolk never fared well against non-blue mid-range fatties. Also, they're largely unaffected by Chalice, since well, they use it too.

Sneak Attack - even?: Not sure about this. I thought Merfolk was just pretty even against most combo decks.

Lands - unfavoured: I remember Lands was just tough for any aggro deck. Can't imagine Chalice would change this much.

Infect - even: Infect wasn't prevalent back then, but I understand Modern Merfolk has a tough time fighting Modern Infect. Then again, Chalice would do a lot of work against Infect. I would think this makes Merfolk favoured here.


How close is this? If this is pretty close, Merfolk is really only weak to Aggro Loam and Lands out of the top decks. Everything else is close to even or favoured. Am I completely out to lunch on this?

[FANAttIC]

I talked at length for most of those matchups, not going to repeat all.

Just few thoughts:
D&T is favored since they have Mystic for Sword of Fire&Ice, we have to race. Good thing is that we could always employ Warping Wail and start killing everything (or use Clique, Venser, Manriki, Truth...).
We are favored over most Delver decks (not all), because Chalice is, well, Chalice.
Elves is really poor us, Chalice or not, one of the worst matchups. Some games I had everything I could possibly want against them (Chalice on one, Cage, Jitte... but they have Decays, etb Elves that destroys Artifacts, Grip...).
I actually think Aggro Loam and Lands are not bad, Relic of Progenitus and TNN are all stars. Loam's strategy of Chalice on 1 and Wastelanding everything is not the best against us. Chalice on 2 might be a problem but we also have Vial, Cavern and enough three drops. Lands can not deal with TNN and we have many tools for 20/20: Relic, Truth, Sumberge, Venser, some even play Harbinger. We have other tools for these two in 75.

We are playing Chalice for... years?, it isn't a new thing. Chalice is one of the reasons why Merfolk and Aggro Loam are great choice in the right hands.

[Chronatog]

Elves is really poor us, Chalice or not, one of the worst matchups. Some games I had everything I could possibly want against them (Chalice on one, Cage, Jitte... but they have Decays, etb Elves that destroys Artifacts, Grip...).
Cursed Totem and Arcane Laboratory help a lot. Totem is good against many other decks (e.g. Maverick, MUD, Aluren, etc). Laboratory is less helpful now after the demise of Omnitell, but still good enough against decks that rely on casting multiple spell per turn (Elves, Storm, Cantrip-heavy decks) and perhaps is a better alternative to Back to Basics as we run 8 to 10 non-basics ourselves.

[sirgubster9]

quick question, if I have out a lord of atlantis and a silvergill and my opponent has an island and I enter my attack phase, can my opponent bolt my lord and then be able to block my silvergill? or will i be able to decide not to attack with the silvergill once he bolts my lord? I probably wrote that weird, but hopefully you can see what Im going for. please let me know. thank you

[ironclad8690]

quick question, if I have out a lord of atlantis and a silvergill and my opponent has an island and I enter my attack phase, can my opponent bolt my lord and then be able to block my silvergill? or will i be able to decide not to attack with the silvergill once he bolts my lord? I probably wrote that weird, but hopefully you can see what Im going for. please let me know. thank you

The parts of combat go:

1) Begin Combat
2) Declare Attackers
3) Declare Blockers
4) Damage
5) End of Combat

If you are the attacking (active) player, each of these steps is gone through. Your opponent will have an opportunity at the end of each phase to play instants.

Here is what I think you mean:

You have Lord of Atlantis and Silvergill Adept. You have to declare your attackers once the Declare Attackers step is reached. If your opponent Bolts your Lord of Atlantis at the end of the Begin Combat step, you can hold back the Silvergill. If your opponent lets you Declare Attackers, he can then Bolt the Lord and be able to block the Silvergill Adept.

I think that is what you mean?

[sirgubster9]

The parts of combat go:

1) Begin Combat
2) Declare Attackers
3) Declare Blockers
4) Damage
5) End of Combat

If you are the attacking (active) player, each of these steps is gone through. Your opponent will have an opportunity at the end of each phase to play instants.

Here is what I think you mean:

You have Lord of Atlantis and Silvergill Adept. You have to declare your attackers once the Declare Attackers step is reached. If your opponent Bolts your Lord of Atlantis at the end of the Begin Combat step, you can hold back the Silvergill. If your opponent lets you Declare Attackers, he can then Bolt the Lord and be able to block the Silvergill Adept.

I think that is what you mean?

Yes thats exactly what I was trying to figure out, so basically you can get super screwed to instant removal and there is pretty much nothing you can do about it. Ok thank you

[spankyourmonkey]

Has anyone tried running Spatial Contortion or Warping Wail MD? How did it turn out? I feel that the deck really needs removal for some problematic creatures (e.g. SFM, DRS, Flipped Delver) and these cards seem like a good solution for improving our situation G1.

[Curby]

I haven't. People have used Dismember in the past when they needed removal. For the record, Clique can largely invalidate SFM, and bouncing your other two examples with active Chalice works. The difference is that Clique, Truth, and Chalice aren't quite as good at direct removal, but they're so useful in other circumstances.

[wasabizod]

Finished off a league at 5-0 today on MTGO. The SB is a bit unique but has been working on my paper meta, so I figured I'd try it online. I played against Storm (2-1), Show and Tell (2-1), Esper Stoneblade (2-0), Eldrazi (2-1), and Esper Stoneblade (2-1). For both of the post-board games with stoneblade, I tried taking out vial to bring in null rod and back to basics, which ended up being really effective. Perhaps not the best idea, but it worked. I haven't sprung for Wasteland online yet, which is why they're missing here. Typically I play 3 Cavern, 2 Wasteland, 12 Island.

MD:
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
13 Island

4 Aether Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Umezawa's Jitte

4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergil Adept
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 True-Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Vendilion Clique

2 Echoing Truth
4 Force of Will

SIDEBOARD
2 Back to Basics
1 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Flusterstorm
2 Hibernation
2 Null Rod
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Umezawa's Jitte

I've been playing more mono-red sneak attack and grixis delver lately, so it was nice to whip through a league fish slapping people again. I forgot how resilient the deck is.

[FANAttIC]

5 cards are missing in your 60. +3 Image and +2 Force?

[wasabizod]

5 cards are missing in your 60. +3 Image and +2 Force?

Haha yeah, good catch. It was late last night and I must have glazed over them while typing.

[FANAttIC]

Then great! All I hear is people winning with this maindeck, we are approaching stock list and hopefully reaching our peak at double GP (Columbus and Prague) 2 months from now.
They will never know what hit them (ok, it will be TNN with their name stickered on it, but still)!

[Finn]

Hey folks. It has been a long time since I have been involved in this deck beyond a casual peek in here. I would like to keep some sort of value to the OP. Can I get someone to supply a stock list and a very quick matchup analysis for it?

[CptHaddock]

Hey folks. It has been a long time since I have been involved in this deck beyond a casual peek in here. I would like to keep some sort of value to the OP. Can I get someone to supply a stock list and a very quick matchup analysis for it?

I have not played the fishfolk in a while but the chalice lists have been putting up the best results so I imagine that is where you want to start. I think for the most part the following are pretty set in stone, so about 52-55 cards. So you have about 5-8 flex spots to adapt the deck to your meta. You have some leeway with the island count as well, I prefer 10 Island, 2 Wasteland, 4 Mutavault and 4 Cavern of Souls.

4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis
0-3 Phantasmal Image

4 Aether Vial
4 Chalice of the Void

4 Force of Will

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
12 Island

[kingtk3]

Hey folks. It has been a long time since I have been involved in this deck beyond a casual peek in here. I would like to keep some sort of value to the OP. Can I get someone to supply a stock list and a very quick matchup analysis for it?

Hi Finn, I've used to play merfolk long ago but recently I've rediscovered my love for the deck and won a small tournament at my LGS with this list

4 cursecatcher
4 lord of atlantis
4 master of the pearl trident
4 silvergill adept
4 true-name nemesis
2 harbinger of the tides
3 phantasmal image
2 Vendilion Clique
4 force of will
3 Chalice of the Void
4 aether vial
2 umezawa's jitte

10 island
2 wasteland
4 mutavault
4 cavern of souls

Side
2 venser, shaper savant
2 dismember
2 warping wail
2 flusterstorm
2 spell pierce
2 back to basics
2 relic of progenitus
1 chalice of the void


I think other people play lists similar to this one, and I'm almost sure that Fanattic's list differs only of a pair of card from the above (btw, good job pushing this thread over bud!), but ultimately it's a matter of preference because there are quite a few flex slots.

I think merfolk's core is

4 cursecatcher
4 lord of atlantis
4 master of the pearl trident
4 silvergill adept
4 true-name nemesis
2 phantasmal image
4 force of will
4 aether vial
10 island
4 mutavault
3 cavern of souls
13 flex slots


Those flex slots can be covered by a number of cards like

3-4 daze
3-4 chalice of the void
1-2 kira, the great glass-spinner
1-2 vendilion clique
1-2 spell pierce
1-2 warping wail
1-2 umezawa's jitte
1-2 phantasmal image
1 cavern of souls
1-2 island
1-4 wasteland
1-3 harbinger of the tides
1 echoing truth


I've exluded some of the old played cards that are not played anymore, like standstill, focusing on the pool of the most recently played.

Of course some choices goes well with the some others, like playing daze and spell pierce with a full set of wasteland, but are bad with other (like spell pierce and chalice in the same main deck).

Most of the cards not in the maindeck can be found in the side (like vendilion, echoing truth and pierce).

I ask other active players to give their opinion on the matter since I may be inaccurate since I've been a long time without playing the deck.

MU analisys to come.

Cheers.

[wasabizod]

Hey folks. It has been a long time since I have been involved in this deck beyond a casual peek in here. I would like to keep some sort of value to the OP. Can I get someone to supply a stock list and a very quick matchup analysis for it?

I think my list (a few slots above) is close to what Fanattic plays (and what I would consider stock) for the main deck.

Depending on your meta, more Jitte or more Echoing Truth or even more creatures may work, but I've been very happy with my set up.

Important cards in my sideboard are 2 Back to Basics, 2 Flusterstorm, and 2 Submerge. (I don't have sub on MTGO because it's expensive). The rest flexes but often includes relic, Pithing Needle, and something else to help against combo.

My hardest match ups are shardless, Elves, and D&T.

[tuxdev]

spankyourmonkey: I've been extremely pleased with Warping Wail, so much so that I run 3 maindeck. It's so very flexible and all 3 modes (yes, even the scion) have been very very relevant.

Finn: I've been working on a new primer for a little while now, and this here's the list I use (and discuss)

Creatures
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Phantasmal Image
4 True-name Nemesis

Disruption
4 Force of Will
3 Warping Wail
1 Echoing Truth
4 Chalice of the Void

Mana
4 Aether Vial
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
2 Wasteland
10 Island

Sideboard
3 Dismember
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Flusterstorm
2 Null Rod
1 Back to Basics
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Echoing Truth
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

As for matchups, Merfolk is *still* fundamentally an anti-blue deck, though it's gotten so so much better against the non-blue decks with TNN. I think it's secretly a DTB but people still think of it too much as a "noob deck" and want to play brainstorms too much. There's not really much about Merfolks that screams "I'm doing powerful legacy things". I think the biggest, most important shift in Merfolks is in "deck philosophy". With Daze getting dropped for Chalices and the reduction of Wastelands, I don't think of Merfolk as a tempo deck anymore, we're actually a Blue Stompy list.

[wasabizod]

With Daze getting dropped for Chalices and the reduction of Wastelands, I don't think of Merfolk as a tempo deck anymore, we're actually a Blue Stompy list.

This times 1000. I think this is something we should embrace. A lot of times we do not want to trade 1-for-1 because the more fish we have, the better they all get. This is not true of a tempo deck.

I'm intrigued with the Warping Wail inclusion. I'll definitely give that a try, and I like your sideboard. I've been running Faerie Macabre in other lists to deal with Reanimator, which is definitely a challenge, though I don't have any at my local meta. I'm not going to Columbus or Prague because of work, but trying to put in time on MTGO and weekly to push this forward. Will report back.

[GreatWhale]

This is what I've been running just at my LGS:

4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergill Adept
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Master of Pearl Trident
4x Merrow Rejeerey
4x True Name Nemesis
1x Phantasmal Image

3x Standstill

4x Aether Vial
1x Umezawa's Jitte

4x Force of Will
1x Misdirection
2x Echoing Truth

2x Wasteland
3x Cavern of Souls
4x Mutavault
11x Island

4x Chalice of the Void
1x Graffdiggers Cage
3x Relic of Progenitus
2x Pithing Needle
2x Spell Pierce
2x Spreading Seas
2x Harbinger of the Tides
1x Kira, Great Glass-Spinner



At the monthly I went 3-1 beating The Rock with Siege Rhinos, Aggro Loam, and Miracles, I lost to affinity. I really liked Rejeerey to tap down blockers against all the non-blue decks, and I like a real lord over image because they can still target through a chalice and kill the image, or its your only lord and there's nothing to copy.

Standstill has been a house, playing it on turn 2 with Vial in play is back breaking, obviously thats the dream, but anytime you have TNN or mutavaults, Standstill is a must break for them and 1U for 3 cards is the best card draw in the format.

The board is pretty effective, I have a lot of graveyard decks and lands in my meta, thats also why I maindeck wastelands, its not unusual to have a tabernacle come down, or maze of ith is annoying.

[rothgar13]

Hey guys,

I'm a long-time Modern Merfolk player that's getting ready to make the leap into Legacy. This is the list I'm thinking of working my way up to:

Legions of Atlantis v. 2

Artifacts (8)
4 AEther Vial
4 Chalice of the Void

Creatures (24)
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Merrow Reejerey
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis

Instants (8)
4 Daze
4 Force of Will

Lands (20)
4 Cavern of Souls
10 Island
4 Mutavault
2 Wasteland

Sideboard (15)
2 Echoing Truth
2 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Harbinger of the Tides
2 Relic of Progenitus
4 Spreading Seas
1 Umezawa's Jitte

I know I'm making some rather unorthodox decisions, but allow me to try and explain myself:

Daze - I know that a lot of people are down on this card of late, but I have still found it useful. I've used it to pull the rug out from my opponent in the mirror (stripping his islandwalk by bouncing my Island), and I feel a lot more comfortable against the likes of Storm and Reanimator by having a critical density of count

Merrow Reejerey - I know he's a bit slow, but this is a nod to the deck evolving into Blue Stompy (as was described above). I want as much pump as I can get my hands on, and this (unlike Phantasmal Image) stands on its own and plays nice with Cavern of Souls and Silvergill Adept. Furthermore, with 6 true colorless sources and 4 conditional colorless sources in my mainboard, the 2U casting cost can sometimes be easier to get through.

Harbinger of the Tides - This card is still under testing, but I think it's a potent way to stuff the deck with bodies for attrition matchups (where AEther Vial is not so hot), and a quick tempo tool that can come in handy against the likes of Infect.

Spreading Seas - I know that Blue dominates Legacy and that makes this less potent than it is in Modern, but this is essentially a concession to the existence of non-blue decks that can stonewall our attackers. I'm specifically thinking of the likes of Eldrazi and Maverick, though it also happens to do some good work against Lands (a matchup that can be pretty tough without it, from what I've read - I've only faced it once myself).

Anyway, I would love to hear some thoughts on this list.

[GreatWhale]

I know I'm making some rather unorthodox decisions, but allow me to try and explain myself:

Daze - I know that a lot of people are down on this card of late, but I have still found it useful. I've used it to pull the rug out from my opponent in the mirror (stripping his islandwalk by bouncing my Island), and I feel a lot more comfortable against the likes of Storm and

Merrow Reejerey - I know he's a bit slow, but this is a nod to the deck evolving into Blue Stompy (as was described above). I want as much pump as I can get my hands on, and this (unlike Phantasmal Image) stands on its own and plays nice with Cavern of Souls and Silvergill Adept. Furthermore, with 6 true colorless sources and 4 conditional colorless sources in my mainboard, the 2U casting cost can sometimes be easier to get through.

Harbinger of the Tides - This card is still under testing, but I think it's a potent way to stuff the deck with bodies for attrition matchups (where Æther Vial is not so hot), and a quick tempo tool that can come in handy against the likes of Infect.

Spreading Seas - I know that Blue dominates Legacy and that makes this less potent than it is in Modern, but this is essentially a concession to the existence of non-blue decks that can stonewall our attackers. I'm specifically thinking of the likes of Eldrazi and Maverick, though it also happens to do some good work against Lands (a matchup that can be pretty tough without it, from what I've read - I've only faced it once myself).

Anyway, I would love to hear some thoughts on this list.

Nothing too unorthodox here, all of this is fine and playable but with time you may change your mind.

Daze - Is just not what Merfolk is trying to do anymore, what are you dazing? Storm doesn't go off on turn 1 and will play a petal before they dark rit. I would also not build my deck expecting a mirror, its really uncommon and unless you are running llawan its not really going to do it, it will just be a race. The best use I can picture is a Turn 2 Lililiana. I dont know, I say run it until you cut it.

Rejeerey - Look above, I just posted about him. I love him, a real lord and the tap/untap is very relevant.

Harbinger - It seems good, I've yet to have it impact a game from the sideboard.

Spreading Seas - Also like Harbinger, it seems good and relevant but have yet to have it impact a game (positive or negative) from the sideboard.

I'd recommend moving at least 1 echoing truth to the main, it really is a wonderful card that can be a random catch all, blow out some mentor tokens or just pitch it to FoW if its too early or you don't need it.

[rothgar13]

I guess the reason why I still have Daze is because I'm very apprehensive of lowering my counterspell density, and I don't really know what else to put in to replace it. Echoing Truth might be able to do fulfill some of the functions that I'm looking for, but using that one actually involves keeping mana open. I think I'll go with the "run it until I cut it" line of thinking.

I'll freely admit the Harbingers and Seas are experiments, and they're mostly brought in as responses to decks I've heard Legacy Merfolk struggles against but Modern Merfolk does not (except for Lands - there I'm just speculating), in large part due to these cards. We'll see if they're relevant enough to justify their inclusion. Otherwise, there's plenty of tech for me to choose from as substitutes (I'm particularly looking forward to testing Back to Basics).

[wasabizod]

I guess the reason why I still have Daze is because I'm very apprehensive of lowering my counterspell density, and I don't really know what else to put in to replace it. Echoing Truth might be able to do fulfill some of the functions that I'm looking for, but using that one actually involves keeping mana open. I think I'll go with the "run it until I cut it" line of thinking.

I'll freely admit the Harbingers and Seas are experiments, and they're mostly brought in as responses to decks I've heard Legacy Merfolk struggles against but Modern Merfolk does not (except for Lands - there I'm just speculating), in large part due to these cards. We'll see if they're relevant enough to justify their inclusion. Otherwise, there's plenty of tech for me to choose from as substitutes (I'm particularly looking forward to testing Back to Basics).

Nice to see a familiar face from the MTGSalvation modern boards.

I don't think Reej is a totally crazy idea. Another local fish player runs a 3/3 split of Image and Reej and has found it helpful. I may give that a try at this weekend's event.

I also have wondered the same thing about spreading seas. It's probably the card I miss the most from the modern version, even though I run back to basics in my sideboard. I've been playing a lot of mono read sneak attack lately, and having more ways to prevent other people from using their lands effectively is amazing.

I know Nikachu runs two harbingers in the board, and that has been somewhat effective. I've been running submerge because it's free for the creatures I care about (Marit Lage in Lands, Goyf, and infect creatures), but YMMV.

I'll do some goldfishing and then post back with where things end up before the event.

[rothgar13]

Yeah, Submerge is a heck of a card. I really should make some room for that in the SB. I'll see how my experimental choices pan out, but I definitely have that and Back to Basics as the proverbial "first cards in".

[wasabizod]

spankyourmonkey: I've been extremely pleased with Warping Wail, so much so that I run 3 maindeck. It's so very flexible and all 3 modes (yes, even the scion) have been very very relevant.

Finn: I've been working on a new primer for a little while now, and this here's the list I use (and discuss)

Creatures
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Phantasmal Image
4 True-name Nemesis

Disruption
4 Force of Will
3 Warping Wail
1 Echoing Truth
4 Chalice of the Void

Mana
4 Aether Vial
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
2 Wasteland
10 Island

Sideboard
3 Dismember
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Flusterstorm
2 Null Rod
1 Back to Basics
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Echoing Truth
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

As for matchups, Merfolk is *still* fundamentally an anti-blue deck, though it's gotten so so much better against the non-blue decks with TNN. I think it's secretly a DTB but people still think of it too much as a "noob deck" and want to play brainstorms too much. There's not really much about Merfolks that screams "I'm doing powerful legacy things". I think the biggest, most important shift in Merfolks is in "deck philosophy". With Daze getting dropped for Chalices and the reduction of Wastelands, I don't think of Merfolk as a tempo deck anymore, we're actually a Blue Stompy list.


Tuxdev - I saw your wins on Mtgtop8.com (http://mtgtop8.com/search?player=tuxdev)

Is there a reason for the 2 Mishra's Factory versus Wasteland? Is this an MTGO price thing or a preference?

[tuxdev]

Pretty much just an MTGO price thing. I don't really want to get them now when EMA is coming down soon enough. Against miracles the factories are awesome and significantly better than wastelands. Against most everything else.. not so much.

[the_goat]

it looks like the last succesfull lists are running daze along with chalice

http://tcdecks.net/archetype.php?archetype=Merfolks&format=Legacy

any thoughts? please compare majority of decks of April
they are putting up good results in decent sized tournaments

[FANAttIC]

The most worrying thing in that link is the "Most played cards in Merfolks" section.
There is no equal number of Lords, Adept (as the best card in the deck) is only the third most played card?!...
What were they thinking?

[rothgar13]

it looks like the last succesfull lists are running daze along with chalice

http://tcdecks.net/archetype.php?archetype=Merfolks&format=Legacy

any thoughts? please compare majority of decks of April
they are putting up good results in decent sized tournaments

This is what I've been doing, and it feels pretty strong. 12 counterspells (16 if you count Cursecatcher) mean you basically always beat combo, which will up your win percentages big time.

[Curby]

The most worrying thing in that link is the "Most played cards in Merfolks" section.
There is no equal number of Lords, Adept (as the best card in the deck) is only the third most played card?!...
What were they thinking?

Those cards are listed as 3.95+ average copies, which is effectively 4. There's always some yahoo with a crazy build that happens to do well ... I wouldn't worry about it.

Daze+Chalice is an interesting shift though. Moreover, 20-land manabases and no Wastelands seem increasingly popular.

@Rothgar, I'm a little surprised at the lack of Images. Is the extra aggro from Reejerey more useful to you than the tricks provided by Image?

[Vandalize]

It feels really weird to play Daze without Wastelands. But if it's working, who am I do say anything?

My latest list:

Lands [20]
1 Mishra's Factory
4 Mutavault
4 Cavern of Souls
11 Island

Creatures [24]
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis
2 Phantasmal Image
2 Merrow Rejeerey

Spells [16]
4 AEther Vial
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Warping Wail
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Dismember

Sideboard [15]
3 Back to Basics
2 Submerge
2 Dismember
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Swan Song
1 Flusterstorm
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Harbringer of the Tides

Swan Song is REALLY good in the sideboard. I'd say even better than Flusterstorm. It's a hard counter (sometimes Flusterstorm tax can be paid), it can counter Counterbalance and Sneak Attack, and we couldn't care less about a 2/2 flyer.

My boarding options are:

UW and UWr Miracles:
-1 Umezawa's Jitte
-1 Dismember
-2 Merrow Rejeerey
+2 Surgical Extraction
+2 Swan Song

Eldrazi Stompy:
-4 Chalice of the Void
-3 Cursecatcher
+3 Back to Basics
+2 Dismember
+1 Harbringer of the Tides
+1 Umezawa's Jitte

ANT and TES:
-2 Phantasmal Image
-1 Merrow Rejeerey
-1 True-Name Nemesis
-1 Dismember
-1 Umezawa's Jitte
+2 Surgical Extraction
+2 Swan Song
+1 Flusterstorm
+1 Relic of Progenitus

Sneak and Show:
-2 Merrow Rejeerey
-1 Dismember
-1 Umezawa's Jitte
-1 True-Name Nemesis
+2 Swan Song
+2 Surgical Extraction
+1 Flusterstorm

Grixis Delver:
-4 Cursecatcher (draw) / -4 Force of Will (play)
+2 Dismember
+1 Umezawa's Jitte
+1 Harbringer of the Tides

U/G Infect:
-2 Merrow Rejeerey
-2 Phantasmal Image
-1 True-Name Nemesis
+2 Submerge
+2 Dismember
+1 Umezawa's Jitte

[rothgar13]

Those cards are listed as 3.95+ average copies, which is effectively 4. There's always some yahoo with a crazy build that happens to do well ... I wouldn't worry about it.

Daze+Chalice is an interesting shift though. Moreover, 20-land manabases and no Wastelands seem increasingly popular.

@Rothgar, I'm a little surprised at the lack of Images. Is the extra aggro from Reejerey more useful to you than the tricks provided by Image?

Pretty much yeah. Reejerey feels really good against people who can try and gum up the ground like D&T, Maverick, and Eldrazi too. It's a bit slower, but in those matchups you want a definitive answer, and in the faster ones you end up Vialing it in or pitching it to Force anyway.

[Curby]

If they want to gum up the ground, 4 TNNs + 4 copies is a lot of stuff to get around their blockers. With regards to D&T, Image for SFM for Jitte is quite good. For Eldrazi, Image copying a big beater might impact the game more so than a Reejery. I guess I'd recommend trying it if you haven't yet.

[rothgar13]

If they want to gum up the ground, 4 TNNs + 4 copies is a lot of stuff to get around their blockers. With regards to D&T, Image for SFM for Jitte is quite good. For Eldrazi, Image copying a big beater might impact the game more so than a Reejery. I guess I'd recommend trying it if you haven't yet.

The problem is that you can't rely on TNN and Image to both show up, and an Image without a TNN is a colossal risk, since it dies to anything. Furthermore, it doesn't get to play nice with our tribal cards like Silvergill and Cavern unless it's already on the battlefield. I'm not a fan of the extra variance that Image brings, and my experience is that going with consistency brings the best results.

[Shackles]

Hi guys, i am having problems against Shardless BUG, i tried lot of cards and strategys but it still seems a hard match up for me. If i go to the atrittion war (Ninja of the deep hours, Standstill, etc) i don't put enough pressure and get beaten by some weird singleton that shut down my deck (like Night of Souls Betrayal). If i try a more agresive aproach, discard plus mass removal does the job. Any ideas on SB cards that could help? Besides things that are obviusly auto-include, like Relic of Progenitus or Dismember/Submerge. I was thinking about using Sower of Temptation (Card advantage + pression + hard to kill) but it is probably only useful against BUG in my Metagame (maybe against Miracles also), so i was looking for good cards post SB that are flexible for other match ups, any sugestion is useful.

Also, 4c Loam is giving me a hard time when i fail to interact with their Punishing Fire. I was thinking of using Surgical Extraction, but it would probably only be useful against Loam and Reanimator (which are only 2 decks in my metagame); another option is of course, boarding more Relics, but they are not a permanent solution to the problem. Any thoughts on that?

My metagame is usually composed by Shardless BUG, Miracles, Elfs, DnT, Maveric, Burn, 4c Loam, TES, Reanimator, Stoneblade and UR/Grixis Delver. I resolved the problem of Elves being an unwinnable match playing Chalice MD (wich is also great against Delver decks and a lot of other decks) plus Hibernation and Graffdiger post SB. Against DnT, Tidal Warrior plus TNN makes the match even (ussualy favuorable).


This is my current list:

Lands 20:
10 Island
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
2 Mishra's Factor

Creatures 30:
4 Cursecatcher
4 Tidal Warrior
4 Silvergil Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True-Name Nemesis
2 Harbinger of the Tides (currently under test)
2 Phantasmal Image
2 Vendillion Clique

Spells 8:
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void

2 Flex slots
Right now i am testing:
1 Island (20 lands withouth Vial seemes a little low; and Island, Island, Cavern + TNN are one of the best plays of the deck in my opinion)
1 Misdirection (5th FoW, sometimes better, sometimes worse, incredible against BUG, worst case scenario, you exile it with FoW)

Sideboard 15:
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Manriki-Gusari
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Hibernation
2 Sumberge
4 Flex slots (wich i would like to be things against BUG and Loam)



Please don't suggest big changes in the MD (like using Standstill, Vial, Wasteland, Merrow, Cosi's, etc.), this are all thing that i have already considered, tested and played. I am comfortably with the style of play of my current MD list and i am achieving good results in tournaments (ussualy only losing frequently against BUG and 4c Loam). I know that a lot of people can't understand Merfolk without Vial, but it's not a fundamental part anymore in most lists, and i think that on this particular approach, it would cause more harm than good (extremely dead draw after a chalice is in play, too much colorless dead cards that can't be exiled with FoW, and no real card advantage like Standstill to suprass this liability), so almost any case when you do not draw it on you opening hand, it's not just gonna be useless, but impossible to even play.

Enligsh it's not my native language, so please forgive any grammar errors.

[Snazzycool]

I haven't played Legacy Merfolk in a while, so take this with a grain of salt, but I liked more Misdirection and/or Divert as a sideboard option against Shardless. Misdirecting a Hymn, Abrupt Decay, or Ancestral is a big game. I also think that it's worth having some number of Tidebinder Mage in the sideboard. It's not free like Submerge, but it hits more targets (Lavamancer being a big one) and is a two-for-one. It helps against KotR Loam decks, though Punishing Fire is still a problem.

Unfortunately, I don't think there's a great answer to Punishing Fire outside of TNN or resolving double Lord or going off the deep end and playing Master of Waves. That's just one of the perils of playing a bunch of dorks, and one of the reasons why Loam decks are so good. Surgical/Relic are ok, and should be brought in for that matchup no matter what. You could go for something like Kira/Monastery Siege to make their removal worse. You could also play something with 3+ toughness, like say Skaab Ruinator. Or maybe something like Cloudform/Neurok Commando. Additionally, you do have access to cards like Back to Basics and Winter Orb, which are brutal against Loam decks.

[Neo900]

I played merfolk for a very long time when I switched to deathblade.
Loam is really a bad Match up. Back to basics is okay but we are playing many non basics. Cavern, mutavault, Wasteland. winter orb seems good but I never played it. the problem I always had with merfolk is that I had no chance to get a better draw. if I don't draw a creature it was horrible.
also I played chrome mox for chalice 1st turn or 1st turn lord which worked out great.

[kamikaze360]

So, I am new to reading the awesome forum insights on The Source and only recently began playing Legacy again after a 10 year hiatus (played old Standstill Folk and also BW Deadguy back then). I have the following built and am about to embark on a Legacy League at my LGS with a variety of decks, most notably Reanimator, Dredge, Grixis Delver, Shaardless BUG, D&T, Show and Tell and Jund. Here is my configuration

4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides
4 True-Name Nemesis
1 Vendilion Clique

4 Aether Vial
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Force of Will
2 Daze

12 Island
3 Mutavault
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland

SB:
2 Back to Basics
2 Flusterstorm
2 Submerge
2 Dismember
1 Misdirection
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Grafdiggers' Cage


Basically, I cannot really decide if I still want the Wasteland/Daze package. I know most lists are eschewing them but I have found them to still be moderately successful, if somewhat high variance. I also really like the SB as is except for my D&T plan. I really have only 4 cards to bring in against them (2 Dismember, 2 equips). I have contemplated cutting Submerge for more anti D&T cards but I am not even sure what those might be. Still, Submerge are absolutely golden in the right matches (Elves, Infect, Tarmogoyf decks).

Just trying to reinvigorate the Fish discussion here and get some inputs on my build! Anybody have some recent insights or ideas?

[FANAttIC]

Quote from a user from another forum:

Echoing Truth is the deck's "safety blanket", the existence of it in the deck means that we're never in a straight no-out situation to things like Moat, Ensnaring Bridge, or double Engineered Plague.
Most of us play one copy in the main and it became a staple in starting 60.

I played Submerge a lot, but things have changed a little with Eldrazi. We don't need help against Goyf decks (Relic and Dismember do their thing and we can always play TNN on defense or ignore them if they attack and attack back for more or Islandwalk past them), so those can be Gut Shot for additional chance against bad matchups like Elves and D&T, while still being good against Delver decks and Infect (and Eldrazi if they play Mimics).

If legacy decks play 3-4 colors + 4 Wasteland with low mana count, then we, as a monocolor deck with 24-25 mana sources, must play 4 Mutavault.

I tried playing 2 Venser in the sideboard at GP and they were great. Returning 20/20, Ensnaring Bridge, Sword of Fire&Ice in combat, Glacial Chasm, Elephant Grass and Solitary Confinement, proved their worth. I was even under duress from Liliana, she was ticking up while we both had no cards in hand so I topdecked Venser and waited +1. Lili discarded herself.

[GreatWhale]

Unsubstantiate looks like it could be tested. Great combination of bounce and counterspell:
https://twitter.com/mtgaaron/status/747567655142330368

1U

Return Target Spell or Creature to Owner's hand.

[athosthemusketeer]

So, I am new to reading the awesome forum insights on The Source and only recently began playing Legacy again after a 10 year hiatus (played old Standstill Folk and also BW Deadguy back then). I have the following built and am about to embark on a Legacy League at my LGS with a variety of decks, most notably Reanimator, Dredge, Grixis Delver, Shaardless BUG, D&T, Show and Tell and Jund. Here is my configuration

4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides
4 True-Name Nemesis
1 Vendilion Clique

4 Aether Vial
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Force of Will
2 Daze

12 Island
3 Mutavault
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland

SB:
2 Back to Basics
2 Flusterstorm
2 Submerge
2 Dismember
1 Misdirection
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Grafdiggers' Cage


Basically, I cannot really decide if I still want the Wasteland/Daze package. I know most lists are eschewing them but I have found them to still be moderately successful, if somewhat high variance. I also really like the SB as is except for my D&T plan. I really have only 4 cards to bring in against them (2 Dismember, 2 equips). I have contemplated cutting Submerge for more anti D&T cards but I am not even sure what those might be. Still, Submerge are absolutely golden in the right matches (Elves, Infect, Tarmogoyf decks).

Just trying to reinvigorate the Fish discussion here and get some inputs on my build! Anybody have some recent insights or ideas?

I like this build a lot, seems like the right mix, but I think you trim a Phantasmal Image or Harbinger of the Tides for 21st land: Mutavault #4.

My favorite D&T card is Cursed Totem - also very good against elves, another horrendous matchup. I might cut Back to Basics or Dismember from the board for 2 Cursed Totems. Or maybe some graveyard hate - Legacy sideboards are so much about your environment though.

[Anfylion]

Hi guys!! I can't believe that i've played merfolks for 3 years, and never heard about Tidal Warrior. That guy is really the best one drop i can imagine for this deck. I'm playing 4-copies in a heavy land disruption-tempo oriented deck, and it's makes me win, giving me islandwalk and/or disrupting the opponent mana base. It receives Swords to Plowshare as fast like if it were a Painter in a painter deck :tongue: !!

It gives mana fix too, so i can play 2 Cavern of Souls, 2 Mishras Factory, and 4 Wastelands, the low curve lets me reduce the land count to 19.

The list i'm working is:


free spells
Daze 4
Force of Will 4

1cc,
Cursecatcher 4
Tidal Warrior 4
Reef Shaman 2

Aether Vial 3
Dismember 2
Stifle 2


2cc
Silvergill Adept 4
Lord of Atlantis 4
Master of the Pearl Trident 4
Phantasmal Image 2

Standstill 2

Lands: 19

Mutavault 4
Wasteland 4
Mishra's Factory 2
Cavern of Souls 2
Island 7


Sideboard (not much work on this)

3 Relic of Progenitus
3 True Name Nemesis
2 Sea Singer
2 Flustterstorm
2 Spell Pierce
3 Submerge


Any thoughts? Do any of you tried to play merfolks in this way ?

[GreatWhale]

So I jammed 4 Unsubstantiates into my deck to test out. It won me some games, was dead a few games. I cut it back to a 2 of, haven't brought back in the Echoing Truth or Dazes, I like the card but I feel like eventually the novelty will wear off and I'll go back to Truths and Dazes.

I used to run Tidal Warrior back in the day, I do like having another 1 drop. Not sure I can get behind 7 Islands, I recently cut the 4th Cavern for another Island, but thats after being screwed on mana a few games, I'd probably go back to Cavern, the uncounterable against miracles is definitely needed.

[Shadowwarrior346]

Hi guys!! I can't believe that i've played merfolks for 3 years, and never heard about Tidal Warrior. That guy is really the best one drop i can imagine for this deck. I'm playing 4-copies in a heavy land disruption-tempo oriented deck, and it's makes me win, giving me islandwalk and/or disrupting the opponent mana base. It receives Swords to Plowshare as fast like if it were a Painter in a painter deck :tongue: !!

It gives mana fix too, so i can play 2 Cavern of Souls, 2 Mishras Factory, and 4 Wastelands, the low curve lets me reduce the land count to 19.

The list i'm working is:


free spells
Daze 4
Force of Will 4

1cc,
Cursecatcher 4
Tidal Warrior 4
Reef Shaman 2

Aether Vial 3
Dismember 2
Stifle 2


2cc
Silvergill Adept 4
Lord of Atlantis 4
Master of the Pearl Trident 4
Phantasmal Image 2

Standstill 2

Lands: 19

Mutavault 4
Wasteland 4
Mishra's Factory 2
Cavern of Souls 2
Island 7


Sideboard (not much work on this)

3 Relic of Progenitus
3 True Name Nemesis
2 Sea Singer
2 Flustterstorm
2 Spell Pierce
3 Submerge


Any thoughts? Do any of you tried to play merfolks in this way ?

I would not put True-Name Nemesis in the sideboard, because it is probably the best Merfolk creature. I also think that 7x Island is way to little with 4x Daze in the deck, even with Tidal Warrior. :)

[Turing]

Slightly off-topic question but is there a reason Merfolks doesn't seem to be played on MTGO? I usually look at MTG Goldfish (https://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/legacy/full) for ideas but can't seem to ever seen Merfolks list on there. Even on MTG Top8 most of the lists are from paper events.

Somewhat more related, I recently built Modern Merfolks and was thinking it'd be a good way to get into Legacy (paper). The core looks like it remains the same but True-Name Nemesis and Phantasmal Image come in along with strictly better counterspells in the form in FoW and Daze.

One of the biggest things I notice coming from Modern is the lack of Spreading Seas effects to guarantee Islandwalk. I'm not familiar with Legacy, is there a reason why? Is Spreading Seas just too slow?

Thanks!

[Gunseng]

I play Spreading Seas in the sideboard of my Merfolk list. The mana cost of 2 plays nicely with Chalice of the Void which is why I run it rather than Aquitect's Will.

On a different topic: What do you guys board in to fight Death and Taxes? I have been doing well with my list, but that matchup seems horrible. I play the following list:

4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Force of Will
3 Chalice of the Void
4 AEther Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte
13 Island
4 Mutavault
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Merrow Reejerey

SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Echoing Truth
SB: 1 Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 Spreading Seas
SB: 2 Dismember
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 2 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Manriki-Gusari

[Olaf Forkbeard]

I play Spreading Seas in the sideboard of my Merfolk list. The mana cost of 2 plays nicely with Chalice of the Void which is why I run it rather than Aquitect's Will.

On a different topic: What do you guys board in to fight Death and Taxes? I have been doing well with my list, but that matchup seems horrible. I play the following list:


4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
3 Phantasmal Image
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Force of Will
3 Chalice of the Void
4 AEther Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte
13 Island
4 Mutavault
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Merrow Reejerey

SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Echoing Truth
SB: 1 Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 Spreading Seas
SB: 2 Dismember
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 2 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Manriki-Gusari



Hello. My list looks a lot closer to the older stuff. No Chalice. I've been having good success on XMage with the following:


4 [M13:59] Master of the Pearl Trident
4 [LRW:86] Silvergill Adept
3 [OGW:12] Warping Wail
4 [TMP:340] Wasteland
11 [USG:335] Island
4 [NEM:30] Daze
4 [SHM:34] Cursecatcher
4 [C13:63] True-Name Nemesis
4 [ALL:42] Force of Will
2 [MMQ:324] Rishadan Port
4 [M12:72] Phantasmal Image
4 [DST:91] Aether Vial
4 [7ED:83] Lord of Atlantis
4 [AVR:226] Cavern of Souls
SB: 3 [ZEN:70] Spreading Seas
SB: 3 [SOK:158] Pithing Needle
SB: 2 [NPH:57] Dismember
SB: 2 [TMP:56] Chill
SB: 2 [ZEN:67] Spell Pierce
SB: 3 [NPH:74] Surgical Extraction


Warping Wail has been doing so much for the deck. It gives the deck a reasonable kill spell for Mother of Runes, Thalia, Flickerwisp, Deathrite Shaman, (it's okay against) Delver, Young Pyromancer, etc. Beyond that it counters Terminus and Toxic Deluge. The only match-up where I side all of them out appears to be Eldrazi.

Against Eldrazi I board:
Play: +3 Spreading Seas, +3 Pithing Needle, -4 Cursecatcher, -2 Force of Will
Draw: +3 Spreading Seas, +3 Pithing Needle, -4 Cursecatcher, -1 Force of Will, -1 Daze

You need to be holding the Pithing Needle as a reactive card against the equipment. It will feel wrong because Needle has so many targets, but short of losing to Port, you'll be rewarded by stopping Sword of Fire and Ice or Umezawa's Jitte. The game eventually comes down to an alpha strike, usually aided by Spreading Seas. It's a rather close match.

[Shadowwarrior346]

Hello. My list looks a lot closer to the older stuff. No Chalice. I've been having good success on XMage with the following:


4 [M13:59] Master of the Pearl Trident
4 [LRW:86] Silvergill Adept
3 [OGW:12] Warping Wail
4 [TMP:340] Wasteland
11 [USG:335] Island
4 [NEM:30] Daze
4 [SHM:34] Cursecatcher
4 [C13:63] True-Name Nemesis
4 [ALL:42] Force of Will
2 [MMQ:324] Rishadan Port
4 [M12:72] Phantasmal Image
4 [DST:91] Aether Vial
4 [7ED:83] Lord of Atlantis
4 [AVR:226] Cavern of Souls
SB: 3 [ZEN:70] Spreading Seas
SB: 3 [SOK:158] Pithing Needle
SB: 2 [NPH:57] Dismember
SB: 2 [TMP:56] Chill
SB: 2 [ZEN:67] Spell Pierce
SB: 3 [NPH:74] Surgical Extraction


Warping Wail has been doing so much for the deck. It gives the deck a reasonable kill spell for Mother of Runes, Thalia, Flickerwisp, Deathrite Shaman, (it's okay against) Delver, Young Pyromancer, etc. Beyond that it counters Terminus and Toxic Deluge. The only match-up where I side all of them out appears to be Eldrazi.

Against Eldrazi I board:
Play: +3 Spreading Seas, +3 Pithing Needle, -4 Cursecatcher, -2 Force of Will
Draw: +3 Spreading Seas, +3 Pithing Needle, -4 Cursecatcher, -1 Force of Will, -1 Daze

You need to be holding the Pithing Needle as a reactive card against the equipment. It will feel wrong because Needle has so many targets, but short of losing to Port, you'll be rewarded by stopping Sword of Fire and Ice or Umezawa's Jitte. The game eventually comes down to an alpha strike, usually aided by Spreading Seas. It's a rather close match.

Why do you not run 4x Mutavault?

[Olaf Forkbeard]

Why do you not run 4x Mutavault?

I was expecting this question. I don't think Mutavault is very good in comparison to the mana denial suite with the exception of the Miracles Match-up. That mixed with how good the cards are in general against the average stuff. I'm running Cavern because I wanted more blue sources in the deck, and that puts me at 15 sources. I'd prefer 16 or 17, but the power of the mana denial is worth the minor inconsistency.

With the deck I found that I tend to pace myself which leads to me being a bit more controlling. Mutavault was not helping with that game plan as I saw it. Mutavault kept pushing me into situations where I should be attacking, even when it was fairly risky, as I had nothing else going on. Where I used to be up a beat, they are now down a beat. This means when I get ahead I keep it, and when I fall behind, I pull them down.

[Krimson Viper]

Does Daze ever come out against Shardless and Burn?

[kamikaze360]

anyone on here playing this deck to any kind of success? There is a fairly active community at mtgsalvation.com. Just wondering if anyone is testing anything new or different...

[FANAttIC]

I optimistically check Merfolk subforum here but most people transfered to Salvation.
Personally, I am trying to find solution to D&T which is just annoying with Sword of Fire&Ice.
It will include stuff like maindeck Dismembers and Tidal Warriors (also ok vs Eldrazi), but no results to speak of since Legacy in my area completely died.

[Thorgils]

Someone has already play a sideboard with grip of phyresis against death & taxes?

[tuxdev]

That effect already existed in Carry Away, and it was bad. Adding yet another way for flickerwisp to blow us out sky high is not where we want to be.

[Shadowwarrior346]

I took my Merfolk deck out for a swim yesterday and ended up going 4-1, which resulted in a 4.th place out of 32 players. It seem like there was a fair share of combo decks and BUG decks, maybe the meta will change more in the coming weeks.

Results: 4-1
Round 1: U/B Reanimator 2-1
Round 2: Burn 2-0
Round 3: B/R Reanimator 2-1
Round 4: BUG Delver 0-2
Round 5: BUG Midrange 2-1

Decklist
Lands: 20
12x Island
3x Cavern of Souls
3x Mutavault
2x Wasteland

Creatures: 24
4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergill Adept
4x Phantasmal Image
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Master of the Pearl Trident
4x True-Name Nemesis

Instants: 6
2x Daze
4x Force of Will

Artifacts: 10
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Aether Vial
2x Umezawa's Jitte

Sideboard: 15
2x Pithing Needle
2x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Flusterstorm
1x Manriki-Gusari
2x Echoing Truth
2x Back to Basics
2x Submerge

I might add Cursed Totem to the sideboard to deal with Elves, if the number of elf players in my meta increases.

How have your lists performed lately? how do you think the ban of Sensei's Divining Top is going to affect Merfolk? Personally I expect combo decks to flourish and unfortunately I also think Elves is going to be a great deck now.

[Ehhh]

twitch.tv/ehhhhhhh
I'm known for being a 12Post player in legacy (Rip)
I plan on streaming Merfolk until Las Vegas GP
Come join and add your input :)

4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Aether Vial
4 Phantasmal Image
1 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Cursecatcher
4 Force of Will
1 Daze
3 Tidal Warrior
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Mutavault
12 Island

1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Back to Basics
2 Echoing Truth
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Harbinger of the Tides
2 Flusterstorm
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Submerge
2 Surgical Extraction

[Atherion]

nice! I think merfolk is quite well positioned nowadays - at least in my meta - so I am also planning to buy back into it. :)

[FANAttIC]

twitch.tv/ehhhhhhh
I am half way through this 7h solo concert :)
You could really use some Relic of Progenitus and Smuggler’s Copter, those improve many matchups across the board and give you more cantrips.

[markino]

twitch.tv/ehhhhhhh
I'm known for being a 12Post player in legacy (Rip)
I plan on streaming Merfolk until Las Vegas GP
Come join and add your input :)

4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Aether Vial
4 Phantasmal Image
1 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Cursecatcher
4 Force of Will
1 Daze
3 Tidal Warrior
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Mutavault
12 Island

1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Back to Basics
2 Echoing Truth
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Harbinger of the Tides
2 Flusterstorm
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Submerge
2 Surgical Extraction

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/competitive-legacy-constructed-league-2017-06-03

Congrats on the 5-0!
Why Gemstone Caverns?

[Ehhh]

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/competitive-legacy-constructed-league-2017-06-03

Congrats on the 5-0!
Why Gemstone Caverns?

it's great in this deck

[Curby]

Ok, I'll play.

Why is Gemstone Caverns great in this deck?

[Curby]

Seriously, can someone explain Caverns? I've watched some games with different pilots, and Caverns has thusfar universally been a worse Island in every case I remember it being drawn. Sure there's probably "that one awesome time" it just happened to be perfect when you happened to get your 1-of Caverns and you happened to be on the draw and you cast Echoing Truth on their 12 Goblin tokens or whatever. Are anecdotes of unlikely situations the best it has going for it, or can a compelling argument be made based on average performance?

Also, I'm skeptical of the implied assertion that somehow Merfolk is the only Legacy deck that could benefit from the Caverns' tempo boost. If Baubles let us play 52-card decks in a 60-card format with no downsides, everyone would run Baubles. If Serum Powder let us get free mulligans with no downsides, everyone would run Powder. If Caverns helped you match tempo when on the draw with no downsides, everyone would run Caverns.

If it were just one player running a Caverns, it could be explained as a joke or a pet card or a random crackpot inclusion, but it's more than one person. So ... what am I missing?

[FANAttIC]

I personally just ignore the Caverns thing, there were too many color screws in my monocolor deck to believe that card has place in my deck.
It's just a phase in my opinion, let them have some fun.

[Ehhh]

Seriously, can someone explain Caverns? I've watched some games with different pilots, and Caverns has thusfar universally been a worse Island in every case I remember it being drawn. Sure there's probably "that one awesome time" it just happened to be perfect when you happened to get your 1-of Caverns and you happened to be on the draw and you cast Echoing Truth on their 12 Goblin tokens or whatever. Are anecdotes of unlikely situations the best it has going for it, or can a compelling argument be made based on average performance?

Also, I'm skeptical of the implied assertion that somehow Merfolk is the only Legacy deck that could benefit from the Caverns' tempo boost. If Baubles let us play 52-card decks in a 60-card format with no downsides, everyone would run Baubles. If Serum Powder let us get free mulligans with no downsides, everyone would run Powder. If Caverns helped you match tempo when on the draw with no downsides, everyone would run Caverns.

If it were just one player running a Caverns, it could be explained as a joke or a pet card or a random crackpot inclusion, but it's more than one person. So ... what am I missing?

dude. the symmetry of the deck is all 2 drops - yes it can be a gambit vs wasteland but if you steal turn 1 vs most decks the value of playing turn 1 Chalice can steal a game from most decks in this meta. Try it out if you want .. you don't have to play it

[Curby]

I'm not saying we should all play the same 75, but I like to understand why people make the choices they do.

Now that I understand, I have to say I disagree but am happy to leave it at that.

[Qweerios]

I've always wondered how important Cursecatcher is to this deck. Would it be reasonable to come up with a Merfolk deck playing Deathrite and perhaps 2-3 Pushes to give it some additional tempo, reach, and interaction?

[Kanti]

I've always wondered how important Cursecatcher is to this deck. Would it be reasonable to come up with a Merfolk deck playing Deathrite and perhaps 2-3 Pushes to give it some additional tempo, reach, and interaction?

I love this post. It reminds me of when Goyf came out. DeathriteShamanStill, DRStorm, Deathblade (wait this one is real!), Death and Shamans, Sneak and Shaman, and finally, Deathfolk.

[Kanti]

Bump. Have you guys seen the leaks?

Kopala, Warden of Waves 1UU

Legendary Creature - Merfolk Wizard

Spells your opponents cast that target a merfolk you control cost (1) more to cast.

Abilities your opponents activated that target a merfolk you control cost (1) more to activate

Very strong. Already seen Kiora a lot in Merfolk, now it's going to have islandwalk and swing for 5. Thank you WotC.

[Atherion]

not good enough for legacy, probably not even modern.

[Curby]

Already seen Kiora a lot in Merfolk

In Legacy? If so, I'd love to see a list.

[Kanti]

In Legacy? If so, I'd love to see a list.

Hey, sorry man, I was thinking about Kira. And sorry to the whole thread, I thought that Merfolk had a Kira effect. Wahhh. I still love this deck and wish more people would play it.

[Curby]

Ah, right Kira used to be played in Legacy Merfolk, and she better matches the text of this card.

If Kira was still played, this might be a natural upgrade since it's a merfolk and works with Silvergill and lords. Unfortunately, since Kira isn't played, and we now have TNN to hedge a bit against targeted removal, I'm not sure that this is needed.

Regardless, thanks for sharing the spoiler. I don't keep up with such things so it's nice to get a heads up.

[Curby]

Anyone know the top64 list at GP vegas? Pardon if this is a repeat question.

[markino]

Since ehhhh was one of the placers, we can safely assume that his list was not too different from what he is currently running:
https://mtgdecks.net/Legacy/merfolk-decklist-by-ehhh-694457

[Ehhh]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GP5ELVN5x3c here ya go - I discuss my build of Legacy Merfolk vs most of the online meta

[Lazygenius]

So hello, I have been playing Merfolk for years and started playing just before Avacyn Restored was released and i mainly play in a very combo metagame and this is my list i was hoping for an opinion on the sideboard and think that two jitte's and copters are nice to have because they are major threats and drawing them is hard when you only have one in the deck.

creature
4 cursecatcher
4 master of the pearl trident
4 lord of Atlantis
4 silvergill adept
4 true-name nemisis
4 phantasamal image

instants
4 force of will

artifacts
4 aether vial
4 chalice of the void
2 umezawa's jitte
2 smugler's copter

land
9 islands
1 Oboro, palace in the Clouds
4 cavern of souls
4 Mutavault
2 Wasteland

sideboard
1 Flusterstorm
1 Gilded Drake
2 Back to Basics
2 Dismember
2 Echoing truth
2 Harbinger of the Tides
2 Grafdiggers cage
3 relic of progentsis

I will link as soon as i look up how do do it.

[Curby]

Is Oboro meant to cycle with Copter? Having only 10 blue sources is a bit low. Depending on the kind of combo you're expecting, having one or more Echoing Truth maindeck might be nice. Vendillion Clique is often good against combo as well, and I see you have none in the 75. Potential cuts include Jitte (doesn't do much against combo), Harbinger, and some number of Relic/Cage (unless you see a ton of Dredge/Reanimator/Elves over Storm/SnT/Belcher combo).

[Lazygenius]

Is Oboro meant to cycle with Copter? Having only 10 blue sources is a bit low. Depending on the kind of combo you're expecting, having one or more Echoing Truth maindeck might be nice. Vendillion Clique is often good against combo as well, and I see you have none in the 75. Potential cuts include Jitte (doesn't do much against combo), Harbinger, and some number of Relic/Cage (unless you see a ton of Dredge/Reanimator/Elves over Storm/SnT/Belcher combo).

So I replaced the wastelands with islands which makes it much safer. also i see a lot of Reanimator elves and very little storm and Belcher also the fact that i can easily win if i can draw jitte and copter can easily allow for filtering through land because i don't need more than five lands most of the time.

[Gunseng]

What do you guys think about Herald's Horn? The cost reduction effect is not really helpful in Merfolk, but the card advantage could be useful. I am worried, though, that the card is too expensive for its effect. However, I will playtest it at the next opportunity.

[Curby]

What are you taking out for Horn? I'd rather have Smuggler's Copter than Horn, and there's no room for both.

[Chronatog]

What do you guys think about Herald's Horn? The cost reduction effect is not really helpful in Merfolk, but the card advantage could be useful. I am worried, though, that the card is too expensive for its effect. However, I will playtest it at the next opportunity.

3CMC slot is pretty busy already and Herald's Horn doesn't provide much value as it decreases spell cost by one colorless. In a deck with a lot of UU spells this is not relevant. Metallic Mimic and Mirror of the Forebears are more interesting options. Mimic can boost incoming creatures and a Merfolk creature itself, and Mirror can be helpful in some situations where you need to copy or hide your creatures (e.g. copy Mutavault). Both require two colorless to cast and this can be helpful in a Wasteland heavy build.

And just to be clear, I do not suggest that Mimic and Mirror are good for the deck. I just suggest that these cards are better than Horn.

[Curby]

I don't think we need Mimic: just seems like a worse lord (no Islandwalk, dies to artifact removal, no Cavern protection, doesn't boost Merfolk already on the field) unless we also run crazy stuff like Sage of Fables to take advantage of the counters. Four Bears is interesting but wouldn't we rather run Mirage Mirror?

[Vandalize]

http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/133/248/636395133362356867.png

This has been spoiled in Ixalan, it seems like a better Kira, Great Glass-Spinner, since it's a Merfolk. What do you think? Can it shore up some matchups?

I'd run something like this:

Lands [20]
4 Mutavault
4 Wasteland
12 Island

Creatures [25]
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Kopala, Warden of Waves

Spells [15]
4 AEther Vial
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Standstill

Sideboard [15]
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Back to Basics
2 Dismember
2 Echoing Truth
2 Flusterstorm
2 Harbringer of the Tides
1 Pithing Needle

[Shadowwarrior346]

http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/133/248/636395133362356867.png

This has been spoiled in Ixalan, it seems like a better Kira, Great Glass-Spinner, since it's a Merfolk. What do you think? Can it shore up some matchups?

I'd run something like this:

Lands [20]
4 Mutavault
4 Wasteland
12 Island

Creatures [25]
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 True-Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Kopala, Warden of Waves

Spells [15]
4 AEther Vial
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Standstill

Sideboard [15]
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Back to Basics
2 Dismember
2 Echoing Truth
2 Flusterstorm
2 Harbringer of the Tides
1 Pithing Needle

I could see it as a one of in the mainboard or in the sideboard, because it is very useful against Abrupt Decay and Kolaghan's Command and it is also easier to cast with Cavern of Souls. I can see that your decklist is running some older tech in the form of Wasteland instead of Cavern of Souls and Standstill instead of Chalice of the Void, may I ask why? :smile:

[Curby]

Woah there, I'm definitely not convinced that this ability is better than Kira's. Sure it's better in the mana-constrained early game, but this isn't a 1-drop. Once you get to turn 4+ when you have the mana/vial to play such an effect and the breathing room to do so, mana is less of a concern and card advantage becomes a big issue. I'm quite certain that a deck would be happy to pay 3 to Push/Bolt/Plow an important Merfolk when they have 5 or more open mana, but most decks don't run an absolute ton of removal, and they would be hard pressed to draw, and then reluctant to use, two cards on one of ours.

Kopala being a Merfolk is huge for Lords and Adept, but Kira blocks Delvers and protects Copters, Cliques, and Vensers. I'd note that he does help protect Image, as Kira is too slow to prevent Image from killing itself.

Even if Kopala were heads and shoulders better than Kira, it's far from an auto-include since Kira isn't anywhere in the 75. New cards have to be better than what we run, not better than what we don't run. I'm definitely not convinced that Kopala does more for us than say SmugCop.

[Gunseng]

What do you guys think about Chart a Course? As we normally attack every turn, it might be a decent source of card advantage. I am not sure whether it is better than Smuggler's Copter though.

[Shadowwarrior346]

I'm going to test 4x Chart a Course in my list tomorrow evening. :)

[tuxdev]

The issue I found with Chart was that there's a limit to how many 2-mana cards that don't advance the board you can get away with, and chalice pretty much uses all of those slots. It's super important that copter is a threat in addition to the card dig.

[Gunseng]

I'm going to test 4x Chart a Course in my list tomorrow evening. :)

That's great to hear. Please post your results :)


The issue I found with Chart was that there's a limit to how many 2-mana cards that don't advance the board you can get away with, and chalice pretty much uses all of those slots. It's super important that copter is a threat in addition to the card dig.

That's certainly true. However, copter is not a threat on its own and the most miserable merfolk experience is running out of gas after getting your board wiped. Course might help with that.

[tuxdev]

Copter is great for recovering from a wipe. You shouldn't overcommit into a wipe anyway and such have *something* left over in hand to start applying pressure immediately instead of having to wait a turn.

[Shadowwarrior346]

So I went to my local game store yesterday evening to test out my latest list for legacy Merfolk and I did only manage a 3-2 result, which is okay, but not great. The 4x Chart a Course worked just fine, they often helped me find interaction or additional creatures. They also helped me recover from mulligans.

The matches:
Round 1: Grixis Twin 2-1
Round 2: Czech Pile 0-2
Round 3: B/R Reanimator 2-1
Round 4: U/W Stoneblade with Terminus 1-2
Round 5: U/R Delver / Prowess 2-1

The list:

Lands: 20
12x Island
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Mutavault

Creatures: 24
4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergill Adept
2x Phantasmal Image
2x Harbinger of the Tides
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Master of the Pearl Trident
4x True-Name Nemesis

Artifacts: 8
4x Aether Vial
4x Chalice of the Void

Spells: 8
4x Chart a Course
4x Force of Will

Sideboard: 15
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Flusterstorm
1x Sorcerous Spyglass
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Echoing Truth
2x Spreading Seas
1x Grip of Phyresis
1x Kopala, Warden of Waves
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Submerge
1x Misdirection

How did Chart a Course perform for you? :smile:

[kleiton.lehnen]

Well I'm playing Merfolks for a while and these are my impressions about the new cards from Ixalan...

I'd ratter try Kopala than Chart a Course (ChC). Card advantage is never bad, but keep in mind we are still a TEMPO deck, so an early ChC is a huge tempo disadvantage. This is emphasized because often we consider tempo advantage much more valuable than card advantage; and anyway, if you play the deck properly, unless you get very unlucky, card advantage shouldn't be a problem. Even with the addition of a card advantage card, you still lost the matchups were it should be a real deal, so from me is a big NO.

In the other side, however, playing against decks heavy on removal - like 4c Control and Jund - it's still tough. But in these cases they're playing with greedy mana bases what makes Back to Basics a great tool against them. When we are playing against decks with less removal, Chalice is more than enough to protect us from beeing disrupted. Have in mind that, since we aren't a Chalice deck in our soul, we should always consider prioritize tempo. What I mean, is that you might face situations where it's better to play Chalice plus uncouterable Lord turn 4, than risking to play a Chalice where it might get countered and make you fall too behind in tempo.

Maybe Kopala could fit into a build with a set of Wastelands and some Rishadan Ports? I sincerely don't know. We already have good tools to protect our guys, so I don't see how we could make good use of her in Legacy. So, it's a MAYBE. My final suggestion is cut ChC for cards like Daze or Harbinger, split the numbers with Copter... What fits better with your meta... Smuggler's Copter works much better in our deck. Because we acomplish almost the same thing as with ChC, but at the same time we progress our board, give our creatures pseudo haste and become very resilient to Sorcery speed removals.

I had great results in Legacy RS this year (a local monthly tournament here in south of Brasil), making, in six participations, 2 top 8s, 2 top4s and a top2 last weekend, this last with 37 players (lists will be posted in mtgtop8 soon). Surprisingly a card that's doing a great job for me is Daze. Even when I've played with Chalice (3md) I added at least two copies of Daze and it has done a great tempo job! In addition it's a easy sideboard slot (having expendable slots also helps you in situations where it's hard to side out things, and this could make you nervous, losing focus in the game).

Lastly, there's an Ixaland card that "came to stay" and it is Sorcerou's Spyglass. Spyglass opens the sideboard slot where once pithing needle was. The card is an huge upgrade compared to Needle: information by itself is great, it's not a nombo with challice and our choices will be wider (imagine the cenario where you see the same fetch land in your opponent's hand as that in their board)...

Merfolks is very strong in the meta right now guys! We only need tho avoid playing against Elves. I'm lucky to have a good presence of Reanimator in my field (Elves hates reanimator and combo in general) a good matchup for us. So I see no reason for Merfolks not to be spread all around in the future.

I predict that soon we'll be discussing alternatives for the mirror match.

[FANAttIC]

Copter is just better card than Chart, in our deck.
There will be very few times when we can attack with a creature profitably to enable Chart. Only 4 one-drop creatures means that CtC is rarely active until midgame.
Even turn 1 CC is completely blanked by ubiquitous DRS. That alone makes it 2-of max, for those who want to play it.
Copter blocks Delver, flyes over Elves, rumbles with D&T creatures, helps play around Terminus and million other things, including easier to cast with 4 Cavern, 4 Muta mana base.

For now, I am not seeing Kopala in Legacy, hard to justify him over Reej and Clique. With 4 TNN, adding more 3-drops is not easy. Chalice usually does the protection part, with TNN cleaning up.

I like Spyglass, fun card.

Agreed, there is no reason for Merfolk to not be played more, but that just isn't happening for some reason. Can't remember the last time I played mirror in Legacy.
Luckily, there is Legacy tournament this Sunday, my Copters are ready.

[Shadowwarrior346]

Well I'm playing Merfolks for a while and these are my impressions about the new cards from Ixalan...

I'd ratter try Kopala than Chart a Course (ChC). Card advantage is never bad, but keep in mind we are still a TEMPO deck, so an early ChC is a huge tempo disadvantage. This is emphasized because often we consider tempo advantage much more valuable than card advantage; and anyway, if you play the deck properly, unless you get very unlucky, card advantage shouldn't be a problem. Even with the addition of a card advantage card, you still lost the matchups were it should be a real deal, so from me is a big NO.

In the other side, however, playing against decks heavy on removal - like 4c Control and Jund - it's still tough. But in these cases they're playing with greedy mana bases what makes Back to Basics a great tool against them. When we are playing against decks with less removal, Chalice is more than enough to protect us from beeing disrupted. Have in mind that, since we aren't a Chalice deck in our soul, we should always consider prioritize tempo. What I mean, is that you might face situations where it's better to play Chalice plus uncouterable Lord turn 4, than risking to play a Chalice where it might get countered and make you fall too behind in tempo.

Maybe Kopala could fit into a build with a set of Wastelands and some Rishadan Ports? I sincerely don't know. We already have good tools to protect our guys, so I don't see how we could make good use of her in Legacy. So, it's a MAYBE. My final suggestion is cut ChC for cards like Daze or Harbinger, split the numbers with Copter... What fits better with your meta... Smuggler's Copter works much better in our deck. Because we acomplish almost the same thing as with ChC, but at the same time we progress our board, give our creatures pseudo haste and become very resilient to Sorcery speed removals.

I had great results in Legacy RS this year (a local monthly tournament here in south of Brasil), making, in six participations, 2 top 8s, 2 top4s and a top2 last weekend, this last with 37 players (lists will be posted in mtgtop8 soon). Surprisingly a card that's doing a great job for me is Daze. Even when I've played with Chalice (3md) I added at least two copies of Daze and it has done a great tempo job! In addition it's a easy sideboard slot (having expendable slots also helps you in situations where it's hard to side out things, and this could make you nervous, losing focus in the game).

Lastly, there's an Ixaland card that "came to stay" and it is Sorcerou's Spyglass. Spyglass opens the sideboard slot where once pithing needle was. The card is an huge upgrade compared to Needle: information by itself is great, it's not a nombo with challice and our choices will be wider (imagine the cenario where you see the same fetch land in your opponent's hand as that in their board)...

Merfolks is very strong in the meta right now guys! We only need tho avoid playing against Elves. I'm lucky to have a good presence of Reanimator in my field (Elves hates reanimator and combo in general) a good matchup for us. So I see no reason for Merfolks not to be spread all around in the future.

I predict that soon we'll be discussing alternatives for the mirror match.

Nice results kleiton.lehnen! :smile: I have also had some fine results in the last 4 weeks with 2x 4-1 (one of them gave me first place at my local game store.).

I have moved away from Chart a Course the week after my last post, because it is a bit clunky. I have used both Kopala, Warden of Waves and Sorcerous Spyglass in the sideboard since. They have both worked out just fine and proved that they are worthy of a place in the Merfolk toolbox. :smile:

My current list:

Lands: 20
12x Island
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Mutavault

Creatures: 24
4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergill Adept
2x Phantasmal Image
2x Harbinger of the Tides
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Master of the Pearl Trident
4x True-Name Nemesis

Instants: 8
4x Daze
4x Force of Will

Artifacts: 8
4x Aether Vial
4x Chalice of the Void

Sideboard: 15
2x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Flusterstorm
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sorcerous Spyglass
1x Echoing Truth
2x Back to Basics
1x Kopala, Warden of Waves
1x Vendilion Clique
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Misdirection

I have actually seen more merfolk lately and currently there is 2-3 Merfolk players in my meta (including me) out of a meta of 25-45 players, so perhaps I should have a 1x Llawan, Cephalid Empress in my sideboard in the future. :smile:

[kleiton.lehnen]

I have actually seen more merfolk lately and currently there is 2-3 Merfolk players in my meta (including me) out of a meta of 25-45 players, so perhaps I should have a 1x Llawan, Cephalid Empress in my sideboard in the future. :smile:

Hahaha, the good old times... The Merfolk mirror match is... well, it feels the same as a coin flip. I'm lucky because in my meta there's just one more Merfolk, and we faced each other just once, a loooong time ago...

Nice to see your list! It's quite similar to what I'm running. When I made top2 (6-1... In fact, it ended in a 5-1-1 deal with me and a friend of mine last round, but we played it anyway with me winning),
this was, and is, my list:

So, comparing with yours, MD I cut:
-1 Chalice -2 Daze, for
+ 2 Copter (doing a great job!) +1 Jitte
and also
-1 Island -1 Cavern for
+1 Wasteland +1 Gemstone Caverns
This mana base is kinda greedy, but 14 colored sources proved to be the "stability limit" for our deck. The idea of Copter and Gemstone Caverns come from Tuxdev and Ehhh(hhh...?) and worth a try. These two cards are doing some good job in our deck.

SB - Is more meta dependent so
-2 Cage -1 Kopala -1 Venser, for
+1 Surgical +1 Wasteland +1 Negate +1 Dismember
* I was also playing my 4th Chalice here, but just because I couldn't get Misdirection in time (a card that I really missed, so, it's probably pretty good!)

Let's keep doing the good work!

[Curby]

Against what matchups do you board in Kopala, and what's your boarding strategy for those matchups? More generally, are there really so many spells that are targeting our creatures? As I think I've posted before, Kira seems to be the better choice most of the time.

[Numenorean]

Hey, new here. Just sleeved up the deck and took it for a test ride last night but I'm waiting for the last two TNNs to arrive in my mailbox.

Are there any updated primera and matchup/sideboard guides?

I lost to burn, 2-1, beat ANT 2-0 (had the counters, especially Flusterstorm, and he whiffed), and lost to lands 2-1. I had some misplays and bad draws one game, so I think I could have done much better.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[bakofried]

Thoughts on this list? S/O will be running it at an upcoming tournament.

Creatures:
4x True-Name Nemesis
1x Kopala, Warden of Waves
4x Master of the Pearl Trident
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Phantasmal Image
4x Silvergill Adept
4x Cursecatcher

Instants:
4x Force of Will

Artifacts:
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Aether Vial
2x Smuggler's Copter
1x Umezawa's Jitte

Lands:
4x Mutavault
3x Cavern of Souls
13x Island

Sideboard:
2x Back to Basics
2x Dismember
1x Threads of Disloyalty
3x Echoing Truth
1x Manriki-Gusari
2x Flusterstorm
2x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Relic of Progenitus

4 Image may be too many, but there's quite a bit of Reanimator and Depths at the venue we'll be at. May want to cut one for a 4th Cavern. Also, the 3rd Back to Basics may be better than the 1-of Threads, but I'm unsure.

[djr2]

Opinions on the bans, anyone?

I'm new(ish) to legacy merfolk so any advice is welcome!! :) I've watched Nikachu play it in his videos the past couple years and finally got the money to build it.

Current list I 3-0'd a small tournament with monday:

lands:
4 cavern of souls
12 island
4 mutavault

creatures:
4 cursecatcher
4 lord of atlantis
4 master of the pearl trident
4 silvergill adept
4 TNN
3 phantasmal image
2 harbinger of the tides

noncreatures:
4 chalice
4 FOW
4 vial
1 jitte
2 daze

sideboard:
3 relic of progenitus
3 dismember
2 cage
2 flusterstorm
2 venser
2 spyglass
1 manriki gusari

I played against RUG delver round 1, and it seems like it's an easy matchup for us. Round 2 was ad nauseam tendrils (chalice on 0 and 1 basically is a free win). Round 3 was against U/W Miracles, which was quite the grind.

I'm testing out 2 harbingers instead of copters because I wanted another way to interact with turbo depths, and I'm thinking that new goblin lord from m19 will make it easy for them to destroy copter. I'll see how it goes the next week or so.

[Atherion]

We will have to see how the meta settles but imo we will have to prepare for combo - rea, show and ant - which isn't a problem. DnT and stoneblade will be strong too, thats where grip of phyresis shines.

I don't like relics in legacy, surgical is a much better choice. Relics are too slow against rea, goyf and lands can destroy them with krosan grip. What I like now is vendilion clique, will probably be playing 2 copies. Good against combo, stoneforge and terminus. Not sure about smuggler's copter now but it may be very good since kolaghan and strix won't be as omnipresent as before. And back to basics will be strong too, I have lost games against czech pile with b2b in play because with drs it was so easy for them to generate lots of mana anyway.

I will play merfolk in a legacy trial at MKM prague, curious how that will go.

[djr2]

We will have to see how the meta settles but imo we will have to prepare for combo - rea, show and ant - which isn't a problem. DnT and stoneblade will be strong too, thats where grip of phyresis shines.

I don't like relics in legacy, surgical is a much better choice. Relics are too slow against rea, goyf and lands can destroy them with krosan grip. What I like now is vendilion clique, will probably be playing 2 copies. Good against combo, stoneforge and terminus. Not sure about smuggler's copter now but it may be very good since kolaghan and strix won't be as omnipresent as before. And back to basics will be strong too, I have lost games against czech pile with b2b in play because with drs it was so easy for them to generate lots of mana anyway.

I will play merfolk in a legacy trial at MKM prague, curious how that will go.

Thank you for the advice!!

I scrapped the relics, and added a submerge and 2 tormod's crypt. I recall when I played in the local vintage league that we used 2-3 tormod's crypt in our sideboard so I'm not sure why that didn't translate over for legacy.

I went 2-1 tonight, but split in the final round. I won against two burn matches in a row and then lost to elves due to incorrect sideboarding. Since that matchup is a race, and my opponent agreed, I was told to do the following:

-4 FOW
+2 cage, +1 submerge, +1 dismember

The reason being is that I felt that force is a card disadvantage for that matchup due to having to exile a blue card in addition to casting it. Since they can draw multiple cards a turn off of symbiote + visionary we need to keep up with getting additional cards and using our visionary (silvergill adept).

Good luck at the trial! :)

[benthetenor]

Thank you for the advice!!

I scrapped the relics, and added a submerge and 2 tormod's crypt. I recall when I played in the local vintage league that we used 2-3 tormod's crypt in our sideboard so I'm not sure why that didn't translate over for legacy.

I went 2-1 tonight, but split in the final round. I won against two burn matches in a row and then lost to elves due to incorrect sideboarding. Since that matchup is a race, and my opponent agreed, I was told to do the following:

-4 FOW
+2 cage, +1 submerge, +1 dismember

The reason being is that I felt that force is a card disadvantage for that matchup due to having to exile a blue card in addition to casting it. Since they can draw multiple cards a turn off of symbiote + visionary we need to keep up with getting additional cards and using our visionary (silvergill adept).

Good luck at the trial! :)

Cutting FOW against Elves is suicidal. Cut True-Name Nemesis for starters, maybe Daze on the draw.

[djr2]

Cutting FOW against Elves is suicidal. Cut True-Name Nemesis for starters, maybe Daze on the draw.

I assumed that when I was talking to him. I'll test out your strategy. I really like having a counter when I can for craterhoof.

[Scott]

I'm a sucker for hyperspecialization, and I came across an entire podcast dedicated to Merfolk, and it's an enjoyable listen. It sounds like they do Legacy episodes about once a month, and the last one came out a week ago.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3f4TxiPJ-2Y&t=0s&index=27&list=PLWlmtM68ABJKLCeBnrw9ObgwBujgf49hm

[notkodysmith]

353

I’m going to be streaming legacy merfolk tonight. check out the channel tonight!

[GreatWhale]

Merfolk was recently featured on Channel Fireball's 3k stream last weekend. Supposedly standing first after swiss and losing in the first round of the top 8 to storm on stream.

One of the commentators said he wasn't running FoW main and the 2 games he kept basically all creature hands. The two games he only ever showed creatures, 1 vial and 1 chalice.

There were over a hundred people at this tournament so even the first after swiss is impressive, anyone know anything else about his build?

[grokh]

Hi,

Is this new Merfolk playable in your decks ?

https://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/272/169/200/283/636825596278439261.png

It's a new T1, can boost himself for 1U, and have a looting effect when you boost him !

Thoughts ?

[KobeBryan]

Hi,

Is this new Merfolk playable in your decks ?

https://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/272/169/200/283/636825596278439261.png

It's a new T1, can boost himself for 1U, and have a looting effect when you boost him !

Thoughts ?

when proposing a new card, one must pick a card to remove

[grokh]

when proposing a new card, one must pick a card to remove
i propose remove smuggler's copter in the lists who play it

[Lav Dafka]

This new Merfolk is clearly designed to go in the Standard or Modern UG Merfolk decks that play cards like Deeproot Elite, Jade Bearer, and Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca. It doesn't make sense to me why it would go in a mono U shell. So the only question is, would the upgrade to the UG shell be adaptable to be Legacy-playable?

[notkodysmith]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dy8HtowVAAI0ad6.jpg

I am going to be testing Ben in legacy, basically removing snuggles from the deck. just to check it out for science.
http://www.twitch.tv/fishcastmtg

here's my deckles:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/visual/1642761

[GreatWhale]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dy8HtowVAAI0ad6.jpg

I am going to be testing Ben in legacy, basically removing snuggles from the deck. just to check it out for science.

here's my deckles:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/visual/1642761

How did it go? I like the card but I wish they had printed some mono blue fish that explored, or like a 1 drop blue who explored if another merfolk was played.

[GreatWhale]

Fish is back on the menu boys!

m_boy and then medvedev won the PTQ and then came in 6th at the challenge recently with the same lists. Feature 4x Tricksters and 2x Harbinger, surprisingly no Force of Negations or Waterlogged Groves.

Looks like everyone decided Delver and Dark Depths are the decks to play so loading up on the tap down and bounces makes sense.

[Thorgils]

Fish is back on the menu boys!

m_boy and then medvedev won the PTQ and then came in 6th at the challenge recently with the same lists. Feature 4x Tricksters and 2x Harbinger, surprisingly no Force of Negations or Waterlogged Groves.

Looks like everyone decided Delver and Dark Depths are the decks to play so loading up on the tap down and bounces makes sense.

My question is: what card is better in the current meta? Merfolk trickster or harbinger of the tides?

[GreatWhale]

My question is: what card is better in the current meta? Merfolk trickster or harbinger of the tides?

Trickster easily, not being restricted to the creature being tapped and unconditional flash make it much stronger.

[Thorgils]

Trickster easily, not being restricted to the creature being tapped and unconditional flash make it much stronger.

Yeah, it's true but against a 20/20 tap it is not so much... bouncing marit lage with harbinger mean destroy it... also against delve creature bounce is much better than tap it... and return delver in hand means gain more than one turn...

[Thorgils]

I am testing "brazen borrower", i know it is not a merfolk, but i think is a greate card: we can play 4 copy of bounce spell for remove silver bullet like ensnaring bridge, humility and similar without the afraid of remove from deck list too many creature and in this metagame the card is fantastic... remove fast 20/20 combo and block a second marit lage if necessary, bounce delver and/or block it and bounce a sword of fire and ice or jitte make huge tempo advantage

[GreatWhale]

I am testing "brazen borrower", i know it is not a merfolk, but i think is a greate card: we can play 4 copy of bounce spell for remove silver bullet like ensnaring bridge, humility and similar without the afraid of remove from deck list too many creature and in this metagame the card is fantastic... remove fast 20/20 combo and block a second marit lage if necessary, bounce delver and/or block it and bounce a sword of fire and ice or jitte make huge tempo advantage

I like it, let us know how testing goes. The part of Echoing Truth to return multiple of the same card seems to come up a lot (monk tokens) but being stapled to a flyer might be enough.

[BirdsOfParadise]

Unsettled Mariner
Protects you *and all* your permanents (not just Merfolk)
Protects against spells *and* abilities
It’s a 2-mana Merfolk
The ability stacks in multiples

Works against:
Discard
Spot removal
Wasteland
PW activations

Especially slows the opponent down if they’re trying to use repeated activations/spells — like Porting you over many turns, grinding with Punishing Fire, unloading multiple counters at once from a Ballista or Jitte.

Works well against storm: If someone wants to Tendrils or Brain Freeze you, they have to pay for every copy.

I don’t know what current lists are, so I don’t know what to cut or if the white splash is worth it. Countersliver uses this, though.

Edit: Don’t try to Vial this into play in response to StP, though, since it doesn’t work like Crystalline Sliver.

Edit2: UW Lurrus Merfolk, cut TNN?

[Thorgils]

Nobody play this deck anymore?
We have:
*an istant win combo version with thassa oracle
https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=28122&d=422797&f=LE
*hullbreacher: a fantastic 3/2 flash merfolk that make impossibile opponent extra draw.
*a new version with chrome mox and the new dual card land/spell that can be played as a Land or pitched with force of will/negation or used with chrome mox
https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=28407&d=424726&f=LE

I think that we have enough to talk about!!!

[KobeBryan]

Nobody play this deck anymore?
We have:
*an istant win combo version with thassa oracle
https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=28122&d=422797&f=LE
*hullbreacher: a fantastic 3/2 flash merfolk that make impossibile opponent extra draw.
*a new version with chrome mox and the new dual card land/spell that can be played as a Land or pitched with force of will/negation or used with chrome mox
https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=28407&d=424726&f=LE

I think that we have enough to talk about!!!

Talk about a gamble with that combo. People run 4 FOW, 2 Negation, 4 dazes. While we have 4 FOW.

it would be better in the SB to catch non-blue decks by surprise or when people side out counters against merfolk

[Thorgils]

Talk about a gamble with that combo. People run 4 FOW, 2 Negation, 4 dazes. While we have 4 FOW.

it would be better in the SB to catch non-blue decks by surprise or when people side out counters against merfolk

I also think that the combo funzion better as a B plan in sideboard against deck like death&taxes, goblin or elves that we can not beat with the usual aggro plan but the combo use 8 slots so i am thinking: what do you think about using thassa oracle in the main and in side put online the 4 copy of the self-mill spell?

[Reeplcheep]

From the spoiler thread:


https://i.redd.it/dc31qg0mu4b61.png

This seems pretty great in Esper vial. Turn their PW or emrakul into a charming prince, or your anything into a second soulherder.

This is really good with anything that makes a bunch of tokens on etb. Reddit comments pointed out that master of waves fits the bill nicely. As I believe token copies contribute to devotion, this plus 2 devotion plus master of waves is 4 masters plus 18 elementals for a total of 98 power.

edit: with 0 devotion it is 10 power over 4 bodies, and 1 devotion it is 38 power over 11 bodies. That’s still probably good enough to win.

[Reeplcheep]

Its is also hilariously good removal with Lord of Atlantis

[KobeBryan]

Its is also hilariously good removal with Lord of Atlantis

I see this card used in a more offensive manner.

[Reeplcheep]

I see this card used in a more offensive manner.

What is more offensive than U: counter and “exile” your uro, you get a bear, I get a gaea’s anthem?

[FTW]

The new lord lets Merfolk play a funny tempo game.

Fish FriDaze

//Creatures: 27
4 Cursecatcher
4 Rishadan Dockhand
4 Vodalian Hexcatcher
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Merfolk Trickster
4 True-Name Nemesis

//Spells: 8
4 Force of Will
4 Daze

//Artifacts: 4
4 Aether Vial

//Lands: 20
3 Wasteland
3 Cavern of Souls
13 Island
1 Otawara, Soaring City

[DukeDemonKn1ght]

I’m a little bit sad to come back and find out this isn’t a real deck anymore 😢

[Weapon X]

Thinking about playing this for our league final

4 lord of Atlantis
4 vodalian hexcatcher
4 master of the pearl trident
4 silvergill adept
3 true name nemesis
1 svyelun of sea and sky
3 standstill
2 stifle
2 mistcaller
3 tideshaper
3 aether vial
1 force of negation
4 force of will
1 muddle the mixture
2 harbinger of the tides

4 wasteland
1 riptide laboratory
1 cavern of souls
1 tolaria west
2 otawara soaring city
4 prismatic vista
6 island

[Weapon X]

Well I finally got to play my list, certain there were some changes that I didn’t update… but it played well. Highlight play was easily thieving skydiver taking a one ring. I do think I’d like to get a sygg in the 75 somewhere. The deck needs that card draw and having different routes to get it seems important.

[Zoid]

Well I finally got to play my list, certain there were some changes that I didn’t update… but it played well. Highlight play was easily thieving skydiver taking a one ring. I do think I’d like to get a sygg in the 75 somewhere. The deck needs that card draw and having different routes to get it seems important.

Do you have a more recent list?
Most more lists I've seen from time to time went basically all in on creatures.
Merfolk used to be my pet deck but it is so hard to make it work when you need 3 creatures to do anything while your opponent can outclass you with 1.

[Weapon X]

I do…



4 lord of Atlantis
3 vodalian hexcatcher
4 master of the pearl trident
3 silvergill adept
3 true name nemesis
2 svyelun of sea and sky
3 standstill
3 tideshaper
3 aether vial
1 echoing truth
4 force of will
1 muddle the mixture
2 harbinger of the tides
3 merfolk trickster
1 thieving skydiver

4 wasteland
1 riptide laboratory
1 cavern of souls
1 tolaria west
2 otawara soaring city
4 prismatic vista
7 island

Sideboard
1 gilded drake
1 force of negation
1 unlicensed hearse
1 umezawa’s jitte
3 hurkyl’s recall
2 blue elemental blast
1 hydroblast
2 damping sphere
2 surgical extraction
1 dismember

[tescrin]

I've been out of legacy for a bit (when covid screwed my shop, duals doubled, etc, I sold out of most of it, except Merfolk, BR Reanimator, and a few others that are on the cheap side)

One thought I've been having is Did anyone try to make Merfolk a combo aggro deck?

While I've been brewing there's an easy T3 win with Puresight -> paradise mantle -> Thassa's Oracle

And it only requires Puresight + Mantle + Cantrip to win T3. It would be a "different deck", probably dropping Vials and TNNs (?); but the allure of just outright winning by dropping the grindy aspects has me doe-eyed enough to actually sign in and look like an idiot by posting it.

If it's non-obvious; Puresight + Paradise Mantle tutors any card in your deck, and can be online T3 (T2 if you ran petals or something.) Then you simply need a way to draw a card + cast Thassa's Oracle for 3 mana.
e.g
T1 Cursecatcher (or whatever) (Note: ponder or Brainstorm to get natural 3-card combo is better)
T2 Pursight Merrow
T3 Paradise Mantle, equip for 1, exile your library until you hit Oracle. Cantrip with land-mana to draw oracle. Exile your library. Cast oracle (this is the risky approach, since you lack an extra mana)

If you ponder/brainstorm/whatever into Oracle + Puresight + Mantle naturally, you instead cast Oracle and exile in response to its trigger.
___


While it's true that it involves playing bad cards (Puresight, arguably Oracle), you still have islandwalk lords to beat down most decks with while having a nuclear option available when it comes up. I think the Puresight plan could also be used for random other tutoring psuedo wins; e.g. finding another counter EoT v Storm.

It'd probably need its own thread if it actually has legs (as it adds the cantrip package, swaps good creatures and vial for garbage, etc); but I figured people educated in the ways of the 'Folk could tell me how bad it is :p

Thanks for listening to my jank.

[Zoid]

I've been out of legacy for a bit (when covid screwed my shop, duals doubled, etc, I sold out of most of it, except Merfolk, BR Reanimator, and a few others that are on the cheap side)

One thought I've been having is Did anyone try to make Merfolk a combo aggro deck?

While I've been brewing there's an easy T3 win with Puresight -> paradise mantle -> Thassa's Oracle

And it only requires Puresight + Mantle + Cantrip to win T3. It would be a "different deck", probably dropping Vials and TNNs (?); but the allure of just outright winning by dropping the grindy aspects has me doe-eyed enough to actually sign in and look like an idiot by posting it.

If it's non-obvious; Puresight + Paradise Mantle tutors any card in your deck, and can be online T3 (T2 if you ran petals or something.) Then you simply need a way to draw a card + cast Thassa's Oracle for 3 mana.
e.g
T1 Cursecatcher (or whatever) (Note: ponder or Brainstorm to get natural 3-card combo is better)
T2 Pursight Merrow
T3 Paradise Mantle, equip for 1, exile your library until you hit Oracle. Cantrip with land-mana to draw oracle. Exile your library. Cast oracle (this is the risky approach, since you lack an extra mana)

If you ponder/brainstorm/whatever into Oracle + Puresight + Mantle naturally, you instead cast Oracle and exile in response to its trigger.
___


While it's true that it involves playing bad cards (Puresight, arguably Oracle), you still have islandwalk lords to beat down most decks with while having a nuclear option available when it comes up. I think the Puresight plan could also be used for random other tutoring psuedo wins; e.g. finding another counter EoT v Storm.

It'd probably need its own thread if it actually has legs (as it adds the cantrip package, swaps good creatures and vial for garbage, etc); but I figured people educated in the ways of the 'Folk could tell me how bad it is :p

Thanks for listening to my jank.

People found out that playing Oracle in dedicated combo shells works much better than in a bad aggro shell in a way that loses to 1 removal.
Puresight and Oracle don't contribute to the beatdown plan, paradise mantle does nothing so you're just combining 2 weak plans which weaken each other even more.
You can't really play cantrips in Merfolk because Chalice is too important.

[Fox]

People found out that playing Oracle in dedicated combo shells works much better than in a bad aggro shell in a way that loses to 1 removal.
Puresight and Oracle don't contribute to the beatdown plan, paradise mantle does nothing so you're just combining 2 weak plans which weaken each other even more.
You can't really play cantrips in Merfolk because Chalice is too important.

These are two very important concepts: merfolk is a lord deck and it values Chalice. If only there were a land that made dudes with lord-type text (like getting +1/+1 per artifact) which played Ancient Tomb and could make Chalice on turn 0 and funnel 2 colorless into pseudo-lord dudes.

Saga is the best merfolk; and the only one this tribe needs.

[FTW]

These are two very important concepts: merfolk is a lord deck and it values Chalice. If only there were a land that made dudes with lord-type text (like getting +1/+1 per artifact) which played Ancient Tomb and could make Chalice on turn 0 and funnel 2 colorless into pseudo-lord dudes.

Saga is the best merfolk; and the only one this tribe needs.

Essentially this. Saga replaced Merfolk with blue Artifacts/Emry Stompy/8cast as the new Fish deck. If you want to play scaleable beatdown backed by FoW and Chalice, that's now the deck to play.

Before that, there was an attempted Merfolk list with 4 Thassa's Oracle + 4 Paradigm Shift, but it turned out to be worse than just maxing out on lords and disruptive Merfolk or resolving a BBB sorcery.

[Zoid]

These are two very important concepts: merfolk is a lord deck and it values Chalice. If only there were a land that made dudes with lord-type text (like getting +1/+1 per artifact) which played Ancient Tomb and could make Chalice on turn 0 and funnel 2 colorless into pseudo-lord dudes.

Saga is the best merfolk; and the only one this tribe needs.


Essentially this. Saga replaced Merfolk with blue Artifacts/Emry Stompy/8cast as the new Fish deck. If you want to play scaleable beatdown backed by FoW and Chalice, that's now the deck to play.

Before that, there was an attempted Merfolk list with 4 Thassa's Oracle + 4 Paradigm Shift, but it turned out to be worse than just maxing out on lords and disruptive Merfolk or resolving a BBB sorcery.

Merfolk was already way in decline before saga, but it hasn't helped.
Requiring 3+ dudes and very little ways of generating card advantage merfolk just got out power creep'd.
Competing with Delver was already hard enough, now people can drop nonsense like Murktide without much setup and run actual spells.

[Zoid]

I've been thinking a lot about Merfolk recently and wanted to share a few thoughts I had.

Most crucially, I think the lords are the weakest part of the deck because they are only good if you're already ahead but don't help you at all otherwise.
A lot of merfolk who actually do things cost 1UU which doesn't work in a stompy shell either.
Trying to be either a bad stompy or a bad eleves/gobos with FoW isn't going to get you anywhere.

With recent printings one niche Merfolk could occupy again is mana denial.
Rishadan Dockhand is obvious and Tide Shaper can act as a pseudo Blood Moon.
Given that the deck notoriously runs out of gas fast, mana disruption into Standstill with Aether Vial seems like the way to go.
Vodalian Hexcatcher really shines here as he can turn your creatures into emergency Cursecatchers.

I arrived at something like this:

4 Aether Vial
4 Tide Shaper/Cursecatcher
4 Rishadan Dockhand
4 Vodalian Hexcatcher
3 True-Name Nemesis
2 Svyelun of Sea and Sky
3 Master of the Pearl Trident/split with other 2 mana 'folk
4 Standstill
4 Force of Will
4 Stifle
2 Suspend/Vapor Snag/Brazen Borrower
2 Daze
4 Wasteland
2 Mutavault
2 Rishadan Port
1 Otawara, Soaring City
11 Island

One of the big problems with Standstill is that you need to be able to draw something that can do something on the spot instead of an Island, a Vial and a useless dork.
That automatically leaves less space for dudes which is not that great either but probably still better than nothing.
The land base is a bit shaky as I think I want enough Islands for UU and Daze.
Force of Negation instead of Daze might be an option but I don't think we can afford the card disadvantage.
Spell Pierce might be ok depending on the available mana.

[Reeplcheep]

If 2 cmc lords are bad, I’m not sure you want to be playing merfolk at all. What is merfolk offering you over beaters + spell disruption (delver) or tribes with better hatebears (humans/spirits)?

[ESG]

If 2 cmc lords are bad, I’m not sure you want to be playing merfolk at all. What is merfolk offering you over beaters + spell disruption (delver) or tribes with better hatebears (humans/spirits)?

I wouldn't say 2 CMC lords are bad, but they are slow. I think Merfolk is a decent choice when the format is slow.

A few thoughts about Merfolk:

* It's a blue deck that can comfortably play Cavern of Souls while having solid mana (I would drop Mutavault and play more basic Islands). Back to Basics is another card it could play. Delver is always going to be two or three colors. Delver is going to be better at velocity, and Merfolk should be better in a longer game.

* Humans has mana that's as rocky as Delver's is, or more so. Humans and Death & Taxes are going to have the best hatebears. I don't think Merfolk can compete there.

* Have people seriously brewed with Spirits? I think that tribe lacks depth and is almost always two colors.

I think Merfolk is pretty neglected.

[Zoid]

I wouldn't say 2 CMC lords are bad, but they are slow. I think Merfolk is a decent choice when the format is slow.

A few thoughts about Merfolk:

* It's a blue deck that can comfortably play Cavern of Souls while having solid mana (I would drop Mutavault and play more basic Islands). Back to Basics is another card it could play. Delver is always going to be two or three colors. Delver is going to be better at velocity, and Merfolk should be better in a longer game.

* Humans has mana that's as rocky as Delver's is, or more so. Humans and Death & Taxes are going to have the best hatebears. I don't think Merfolk can compete there.

* Have people seriously brewed with Spirits? I think that tribe lacks depth and is almost always two colors.

I think Merfolk is pretty neglected.

The format isn't going to slow down and even if it did, Merfolk most likely wouldn't gain from it.
Most decks can win with 1 or 2 creatures or at least get a massive advantage.
Playing just lords leaves you with 1 grizzly or 2 watchwolves.
You can't just trade dudes for removal because you'll run out of steam quicker.

I would only play Mutavault if I was running Standstill.
To me Standstill seems like one of the few ways to refuel but in a meta with Urza's Saga and decks which can crack it easily in your EOT this might not be the right call.
Cavern is a meta call if you're not running Chalice.
You need enough Islands to get UU reliably and U to cast your sideboard cards.
B2B main might actually be a neat idea.

Spirits and Faeries for that matter have the advantage that everything has flash, allowing you to run more counter/removal which is nice.
However, I think they have neat tricks but also lack power to close out the game both early and quickly.

[Reeplcheep]

Spirits and faeries do have issues with closing speed and needing 2 colours. But Spirit of the Labrynth and Spellstutter sprite are great counters to the average legacy meta.

[Reeplcheep]

The 1/1 who explores could be really good for the deck.

[Zoid]

https://mythicspoiler.com/lci/cards/deeprootpilgrimage.jpg

This could be really good.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

I saw this today and thought it was a reprint.
Why do I think it already exists?
E:
Deeproot Waters

Yeah the new one is better in a lot of ways.

[Zoid]

I saw this today and thought it was a reprint.
Why do I think it already exists?
E:
Deeproot Waters

Yeah the new one is better in a lot of ways.

You can go full jank and play fishsaysno.dec

https://s.deckbox.org/system/images/mtg/cards/190404.jpg

[Zoid]

Tishana's Tidebinder
2U
Creature - Merfolk
Flash

When Tishana's Tidebinder enters the battlefield, counter up to one target activated or triggered ability. If an artifact, creature, or planeswalker's ability is countered this way, that permanent loses all abilities until Tishana's Tidebinder leaves the battlefield. (mana abilities can't be targeted)

This looks really good because it works with Vial.
Also stompy mana cost.